It's hard for me to say that guns don't necessarily fit in our universe. We have how many races that participated in some sort of space or inter-dimensional travel to get to Terminus? Guns don't really seem that far-fetched to me if any of the races got to Terminus in a space-ship. I'd rather not see them in game but what kind of lore implications are there? Shouldn't we keep the storyline open to accommodate the possibility of other-worldy technology, resources, vehicles, weapons, etc? I thought Terminus was kind of like a melting pot of the universe? Is each race even from the same galaxy?
Guns in the game is a huge question. I have often wondered why they are in fantasy games like PRF. I have felt they are used due to lack of imagination. Magic has many forms and can or at least I would think that is could be used like guns. It’s not a new concept but one I think should be looked at. As for the Gnome races I think in this game and for this creative sphere of Pantheon they are smarter than that. Guns would be a lessor technology to them. They are made of energy and have greater capabilities based off what we know. Just thinking out loud here.
In my opinion they should not be used in the game.
Thoughts?
Ox
oneADseven said:It's hard for me to say that guns don't necessarily fit in our universe. We have how many races that participated in some sort of space or inter-dimensional travel to get to Terminus? Guns don't really seem that far-fetched to me if any of the races got to Terminus in a space-ship. I'd rather not see them in game but what kind of lore implications are there? Shouldn't we keep the storyline open to accommodate the possibility of other-worldy technology, resources, vehicles, weapons, etc? I thought Terminus was kind of like a melting pot of the universe? Is each race even from the same galaxy?
Are they really space travelers or interdiminsional transfer travelers?
As far as guns go I dont see the difference between a magic wand shooting out fireballs and a peice of wood and metal shooting out a slug. As long as it was old style muskets etc I personally would not have a problem with it.
I always imagine what it would be like for native magic ability. Would you invent a cow pulled plow for the field to be sown if you could just magically sow the seeds?
I'd imagine innovation would be at a very slow pace. Perhaps no-one would need to invent gunpowder or such, or would disregard the option as being too laborious.
Dreconic said:oneADseven said:It's hard for me to say that guns don't necessarily fit in our universe. We have how many races that participated in some sort of space or inter-dimensional travel to get to Terminus? Guns don't really seem that far-fetched to me if any of the races got to Terminus in a space-ship. I'd rather not see them in game but what kind of lore implications are there? Shouldn't we keep the storyline open to accommodate the possibility of other-worldy technology, resources, vehicles, weapons, etc? I thought Terminus was kind of like a melting pot of the universe? Is each race even from the same galaxy?
Are they really space travelers or interdiminsional transfer travelers?
As far as guns go I dont see the difference between a magic wand shooting out fireballs and a peice of wood and metal shooting out a slug. As long as it was old style muskets etc I personally would not have a problem with it.
Sorry I'm not entirely sure, hoping a loremaster can chime in. My understanding is that all of the races were from their own planet though so how else did they get to Terminus?
oneADseven said:Dreconic said:Are they really space travelers or interdiminsional transfer travelers?
As far as guns go I dont see the difference between a magic wand shooting out fireballs and a peice of wood and metal shooting out a slug. As long as it was old style muskets etc I personally would not have a problem with it.Sorry I'm not entirely sure, hoping a loremaster can chime in. My understanding is that all of the races were from their own planet though so how else did they get to Terminus?
You can be from your own plane and thus own planet, and possible not even know you crossed over into another plane to get to Terminus...
But, if they did come on some spaceship I expect Destiny 2 style fights in a future expansion, just saying :D
Yeah I didn't mean to imply that each of the races could have spaceship technology. I originally mentioned the gnomes having airships and felt it might lend credence toward the idea of them also having the technology to create guns, turrets, etc. At the end of the day, though, Terminus is truly a melting pot of at least 10 different worlds (9 playable races and the dragon's world they invaded) -- I would expect there to be some significant diversity in their architecture, land cultivation techniques, armor/weapon style preference, etc.
I'm not really a big fan of guns in an MMORPG but I wouldn't completely write them off either. I am by no means a lore expert but I always thought that the storyline was designed in such a way that could basically allow anything you could think of to be added in the future while also being supported by lore. I am particularly fond of the idea of the world being invaded by whatever intergalactic nemesis (or it's minions) that the races were fleeing from to begin with.
oneADseven said:It's hard for me to say that guns don't necessarily fit in our universe. We have how many races that participated in some sort of space or inter-dimensional travel to get to Terminus? Guns don't really seem that far-fetched to me if any of the races got to Terminus in a space-ship. I'd rather not see them in game but what kind of lore implications are there? Shouldn't we keep the storyline open to accommodate the possibility of other-worldy technology, resources, vehicles, weapons, etc? I thought Terminus was kind of like a melting pot of the universe? Is each race even from the same galaxy?
This.
So Im not sure how folks cant see (in any way) that a bit of technology has no place in Terminus. I can understand just plain old detesting it or not wanting it, but not even seeing how the lore could allow for it is a bit wierd to me. And I know that the devs dont plan to take it that direction, but still it seems pretty obvious how tech could find its way in. Thats just me and I know its not everyones thing, but I wouldnt mind a touch of sci-fantasy. Not over the top, just a small bit herand there. And yes Gnomes do seem like the perfect race for a Engineer or Tinkerer type combat class to include small bombs and guns. Why not just have Wizards then? Flavor. And it doesnt even have to be Earthly Tech. Why not arcane machines that work off magic instead of elctricity?
At the same time, Crossbows are close enough if it really bothers folks so much. Im just not a strict fantasy traditionalist I guess.
Amsai said:So Im not sure how folks cant see (in any way) that a bit of technology has no place in Terminus. I can understand just plain old detesting it or not wanting it, but not even seeing how the lore could allow for it is a bit wierd to me. And I know that the devs dont plan to take it that direction, but still it seems pretty obvious how tech could find its way in. Thats just me and I know its not everyones thing, but I wouldnt mind a touch of sci-fantasy. Not over the top, just a small bit herand there. And yes Gnomes do seem like the perfect race for a Engineer or Tinkerer type combat class to include small bombs and guns. Why not just have Wizards then? Flavor. And it doesnt even have to be Earthly Tech. Why not arcane machines that work off magic instead of elctricity?
I don't think the Gnomes are engineers or tinkers really, and I don't think they have airships so much as one floating city/"ship." Since they are no longer on their home planet (now destroyed I belive) they have no means to obtain more of the mineral they use to power their city for use in making other things.
But yes, anything could arrive on Terminus in the future...I still just hope we don't end up with guns/bombs etc.
I think whatever we get will be thematically appropriate (the theme being pretty much standard high fantasy at this point). So we won't have a race showing up with particle blasters and personal shields. But I could see some steampunk coming in at some point, or things like muzzle-loading flintlocks and naval cannon.
I'm ok with it as long as it makes sense in the context of the setting and the implementation is believable - meaning that there should be enough of a drawback to anything that is added that the existing non-firearm weaponry we see around the world still makes sense.
As someone else alluded to already black powder driven guns are just another form of projectile with its own strengths and weaknesses. Thematically I can definitely see black powder weapons do not fit in Terminous if for no other reason than the industry does not exist in Terminous to make black powder weapons more dangerous than throwing a rock at someone. There is good reasons that all rifles had bayonets until WW2, without precision rifled barrels and full metal rounds guns are in accurate and unreliable, but a riffle with a bayonet is a spear and spears are the oldest weapons known to man.
Conversely though what are wands if not magical guns. If we have magical guns in one form we might see them in other forms at some point without breaking the setting.
Trasak
For me its not that I cant see a reality in which gunpowder exists in Pantheon. It's more that I just prefer the more traditional medieval+magic feel. Also, when you add gun you inherently add gun powder. That has more broad application than just guns, right? Bombs, grenades, rockets.... and with understanding of combustion it implies the ability to produce machines. Yes these can be done with a very rudimentary implimentation that fits better with a high fantasy world. But at what point does having primitive gunpowder uses start to slide off the rails and you start seeing motorcycles...