Gaming in general has a fellowship effect, 4 player games on nintendo 64 is a prime example. You don't just form a fellowship with the people you are playing with, u also form fellowship with the Characters that you and your friends create. my brother and i have been playing everquest since 1999 and when we start on a new progression server we bring our fellowship with us. Boxing the toons that we or our friends created way back when. When my brother and i come over to pantheon our fellowship is coming with us. We will create the core of our fellowship with the same race,class,and names that they have always been then create new toons to add to the fellowship. It's not uncommon for someone in everquest to create a friends toon that no longer plays or they have lost touch with and box them in their fellowship. My RL friends created toons in everquest in 1999 and i have recreated them in other games lol. Pantheon is a brave new world but it is super exiting when you bring along familiar faces. With this in mind i think it is pretty important to not have missing player races in a fantasy role playing game. If someones fellowship includes a troll, froglok, and cat person then they will have a hard time letting go of everquest. Im not saying that every race needs to be in the game at launch but it should definitly be a stretch goal. lucky for me and my brother our fellowship consists of Dwarves, Gnomes, elves, and humans. If Pantheon did not have the race of the main characters i play in everquest and every other fantasy games that i play i would have a hard time coming over. If a person playes Trolls, froglok, and cats there is like a 75 percent chance that they just keep playing everquest. I can almost guarantee that if Pantheon dident have gnomes, and dwarves neither me or my brother would look twice at it. A persistent world is important in the fantasy genre because of persistant fellowship, So pantheon must do all it can to let fellowships persist.
First off, Pantheon isn't Everquest so there should be no expectations that anything in Everquest would make an appearance in Pantheon, specifically races. This isn't Everquest3. I find it a bit sad that people wouldn't move to a game with their close friends of many years merely because a player race isn't available. That's quite a limiting approach, stuck forever playing EQ1 because Frogloks aren't in some other developer's game. Wouldn't friendship and class make up for that?
I can get behind OP purely on the premise of the inclusion of more animal races. I'm still relatively disappointed that Skar is the most non-human looking race and I consider it to be very "meh" based on my own preferences.
Ratonga, Vah Shir/Kerran, Froglok, and Iksar WHEN?
Remember that some of those races that have been mentioned were playable from expansions and not on release of Everquest (Iksar, Frogloks, Vah Shir).
I would expect further down the line more races will appear as is the nature of MMORPGs.
I feel we all need to step away from the EQ comparisons and judge Pantheon on its own merits.
Nuggie said: When they say they aren't trying to be "the everything for everyone," I think this is part of what they mean. It's a niche game. It's not going to appeal to everyone. Maybe not you, maybe not me. And that's okay. Without some miraculous deep pocketed investments from a big VC firm they aren't going to have all the bells and whistles that games that have been going for 10+ years have. Just a thought.
Stole the words right out of my mouth.
I can empathize somewhat with the OP. The presence of certain races are a big part of what makes Pantheon a fantasy MMORPG. Traditional fantasy lore, going back even to some very old children's literature, has included gnomes, dwarves, elves, ogres and trolls. Certainly this has been reinforced by Tolkien and the plethora of fantasy writers who followed in his footsteps. So perhaps if you've had limited exposure to literature and all of your fantasy imaginings were from gaming, you'd be just as upset about missing Iksar and Frogloks as I would be if you tried to rip dwarves or gnomes from Terminus.
Celandor said:I can empathize somewhat with the OP. The presence of certain races are a big part of what makes Pantheon a fantasy MMORPG. Traditional fantasy lore, going back even to some very old children's literature, has included gnomes, dwarves, elves, ogres and trolls. Certainly this has been reinforced by Tolkien and the plethora of fantasy writers who followed in his footsteps. So perhaps if you've had limited exposure to literature and all of your fantasy imaginings were from gaming, you'd be just as upset about missing Iksar and Frogloks as I would be if you tried to rip dwarves or gnomes from Terminus.
The downside of adding races/classes after the fact is that it requires someone to start over completely from scratch if they find that new race/class that they just cannot live without. It doesn't affect me one way or the other. I wish that they had Half-Elves, but I can live with being a Human, and my chosen class is already in there, but I can see how it would be a genuine bummer for some people.
It'll always be like that in a standalone RPG though. It's a completely unique universe, even if it lends elements from already established ones. This isn't supposed to be Everquest 3, even if it's somewhat of a spiritual succesor to the original one. For one reason or another they decided against adding animal inspired humanoids in this one, which I'm personally in favour of. As unique as Froglogs are, I always thought they looked completely ridiculous.
If that's a dealbreaker to some, I suppose Everquest is still available to play.I for one, is more excited about getting to know a new universe with its own dedicated lore, locations and races.
Menubrea said:It'll always be like that in a standalone RPG though. It's a completely unique universe, even if it lends elements from already established ones. This isn't supposed to be Everquest 3, even if it's somewhat of a spiritual succesor to the original one. For one reason or another they decided against adding animal inspired humanoids in this one, which I'm personally in favour of. As unique as Froglogs are, I always thought they looked completely ridiculous.
If that's a dealbreaker to some, I suppose Everquest is still available to play.I for one, is more excited about getting to know a new universe with its own dedicated lore, locations and races.
I agree that Frogloks were a bit of a "jumped the shark" race (although I think that they were going for a "All races will be a playable race" moment there), but others, such as Iksars weren't bad as far as "animal-races" go. The "cat race", I forget what it was called, I could give or take.
Kalok said:I agree that Frogloks were a bit of a "jumped the shark" race (although I think that they were going for a "All races will be a playable race" moment there), but others, such as Iksars weren't bad as far as "animal-races" go. The "cat race", I forget what it was called, I could give or take.
Iksar and Kerrans weren't half bad, and there's nothing wrong with animal based humanoids. I'd actually would like to know why they decided against one, as I'm sure it was part of the discussion at some point during development. Maybe they decided it would stand the risk of being too "cartoony" for what they're aiming for.
I cant wrap my head around a notion that you won't play a different race in a new game, let alone that you would refuse to play a new game simply because it doesnt have the race you're used to playing. I guess if you're that unwilling to try something new, you really should just stay with EQ or one of it's EMU's forever, because you're sure as hell not branching out.
munge said:It's not uncommon for someone in everquest to create a friends toon that no longer plays or they have lost touch with and box them
I have never heard of anyone doing this. It might be more uncommon than you think. Wouldn't it be better to make new friends instead of creating toons of your own that are supposed to represent old friends?
philo said:munge said:It's not uncommon for someone in everquest to create a friends toon that no longer plays or they have lost touch with and box them
I have never heard of anyone doing this. It might be more uncommon than you think. Wouldn't it be better to make new friends instead of creating toons of your own that are supposed to represent old friends?
When I "retired" from EQ, and EQ2, I gave my toon to one of my r/l friends to take over.
philo said:I have never heard of anyone doing this. It might be more uncommon than you think. Wouldn't it be better to make new friends instead of creating toons of your own that are supposed to represent old friends?
Maybe to remember someone who has passed away, but would consider this creepy territory otherwise.
Kalok said:philo said:munge said:It's not uncommon for someone in everquest to create a friends toon that no longer plays or they have lost touch with and box them
I have never heard of anyone doing this. It might be more uncommon than you think. Wouldn't it be better to make new friends instead of creating toons of your own that are supposed to represent old friends?
When I "retired" from EQ, and EQ2, I gave my toon to one of my r/l friends to take over.
Yeah, but did your friend move to a new game and make a character call Kalok? Maybe, but I doubt it. I've moved games a few times after my extensive stint in EQ2 where I made great friends who I still talk to. But never have I played in a new game and made a toon after them.
I'm with philo, this isn't as common as OP thinks it is.
Beefcake said:philo said:Dediadeis said:would consider this creepy territory otherwise.
mmhmm. I can't imagine seeing a character based off of myself...
i know someone that named a toon based on their friend that died, but that's as far as i have seen.
Not going into to much detail I have named a toon after someone who was very close to me who died. It seemed natural to me, even though they died pre-internet. I never want to forget her, people may find it creepy but she was the world to me. I carry her name and memory along with me on my adventures. Now I can even think of her with a smile and not tears.
People deal with loss and grief differently. No doubt some people will think I am crazy. I honestly don't care. I am as good as I can be with my loss.
All names ever created are in reference. It is impossible for the human brain to create a noun without reference, even a dogs bark is in reference. We are social beings. Fellowship,Family,clubs,spouce, etc,etc,etc. To create a toon is to create from reference. If Everquest and world of warcraft shut down tommorow the Fellowships that are imprinted in our brains dont just vanish. We would all just find a new avenue to perpetuate them. An account with 10 toons on it is a Fellowship. Some people Alt Tab to another account to switch toons in their fellowship, others camp to the character select screen. Im just saying that Pantheon should be that avenue. Do u think that if Everquest released Orcs, undead, and goblins as playable races tommorow it would bring less players back to the game then a new dungeon full of sarnaks? Most MMO's lack fellowship and make us feel orphaned, Everquest is clunky and its graphics are out dated but it is where my fellowship resides until some parent i don't care what one, conditions us to fear and respect that escalator! I personally have played and added every class and race in everquest to my fellowship. That adds up to about a gazillion hours of playtime. And ive never really played past Planes of Power and i still play everquest to this day. The Agnarr server makes perfect sense. Quality over quantity. If 3 new playable classes and races where available on Agnarr tommorow they would need 4 Agnarr servers because peoples would be bigtime Fellowreshiprocating. Thats a Verby, Nouny, Abjetivy by the way.
Liav said:I can get behind OP purely on the premise of the inclusion of more animal races. I'm still relatively disappointed that Skar is the most non-human looking race and I consider it to be very "meh" based on my own preferences.
Ratonga, Vah Shir/Kerran, Froglok, and Iksar WHEN?
Yeah Iksar FTW how about take the Skar make it Ikskar and make it to more lizzzzzzard haha
But I'm curious how the Skar will look also, I don't care for the concept art so far, the backwards knees remind me of that alien movie The Arrival with Martin Sheen.