Okay, not sure what has been written on things like this so far, but going to throw this out there because it is something I think MMO developers have been missing out on. I'd like to suggest a couple things, so here goes:
First, all great inspiration is borrowed from others. You see or experience something, get an idea and create something new. This is the way the world works.
I'd like to borrow an idea from Perfect World and suggest Pantheon dev's look into implementing something similar. What I am about to suggest was the only thing that kept me playing PWI other than the awesome people I met and loved hanging out with. I'm talking about Territory Wars.
PWI Territory Wars Intruction Video: PWI Territory Wars Example on Youtube
It was a game within the game, seperate from the EXP/raid/grind and even world PvP scene. It was self contained, and simple enough, and imo the beginning of 3-lane highway MOBA's, as this was pretty much just that only with FPS style player and model view as opposed to top down MOBA view.
It could be over as quick as a 5 minutes, but usually went on for an hour or more
A general explanation: The master land map is put up and at a certain time, guild leaders place bids for starting points on the map to battle over with in game currency. No one starts with land, they must earn it with battle! The instance/battleground is basically two bases, each base having a crystal with hit points, and a three lane highway connecting the two bases, which teams pull catapults towards the enemy base to attack their crystal. Protect the crystal in your own base, and attack the opposing teams crystal, bring it to 0 health to win the event and "take over" the land. I tolerated horrible horrible dailies and one dungeon to EXP in (yes there was only ONE dungeon to get exp in for end game... unbelieveable!) in order to play these territory wars. Seriously fun and they also helped build guild/team/server cohesion. Not going to lie, I saw some bad territory wars matches tear a few guilds apart, but it brought a friendly level of competition to PWI that kept guilds together and guild spirit and morale was huge, and communicating between guilds was taken seriously, not toxic garbage with no respect like other mmo's... In the guild Zodian in PWI, I was the Diplomacy Officer, 3rd in command in guild, in charge of defusing problems with other guilds caused by players or general circumstances, and with communicating to organize territory wars to ease the workload of our two guild leaders. This brought about a social dynamic to the game that imo kept everyone very tight knit, and excited to see the outcomes of these land battles etc, and to see who would win the final battle for the last peice of land and win all the territories! Resetting the lands every few months kept it fresh too, not stale or one-sided.
Here is my suggestion for Pantheon to expand on and have things to do other than fighting NPC's and questing content...
Terminus hosts a festival 4 times a year, to begin the battle for land domination. For now, let's call it the Battle of Honor! These battles could be considered a way of fighting with each other to prevent all out war for lore purposes and in-game reasoning. These territory games/battles could be Terminus version of olympic games, whatever works right?
- We need a master map based on Terminus with land divided up into multiple territories.
- There can be no game changing rewards from winning battles or winning the entire map - make the win rewards purely cosmetic perhaps, such as player skins for swords, bows, armor etc. and non-tradeable or sellable. Guild players could earn points via Battle of Honor victories to spend on these fashion items, making Battle of Honor something that is purely voluntary, not a game changer, and primarily something of interest for people who love PvP, as well as PvE like myself. Another option is players can maybe spend points on a certain type of axe swing animation, so their is slightly different from other players... or the ability to change the color or tint of a gem in an item... Oh, and bragging rights are important too of course. I was proud AF to wear my Zodian tag and walk around the server after winning a war, and I also remember the yellow text of territory wars wins helping to recruit new guild members as well
- In place of the instance where the battle takes place being a 3 lane MOBA highway type thing, create something totally new with lanes/roads of course, paths etc, and perhaps even underground tunnels etc to access the enemy part of the map but not limiting it and at the same time, not making the map too complicated or difficult.
- The battle map where the actual battle takes place could be one map only like in PWI or create multiple ones as in WoW, but I think having 3 or less maps would be best for the battles to take place on and maps should be equally balanced for lay of the land, buildings etc for each team.
- Implement moveable useable objects similar to the catapults, and maybe stationary ones too, something unique to Pantheon, designed and exists only in the world based on pantheon lore?
- A trophy room in each of the main cities of Terminus, showing the winning guild names etc, honoring the hard fought victories over other guilds
Instead of protecting one main item for each guild/team, teams could have say for instance 7 or 8 Mana Crystals to protect... colored ones for each type of mana maybe, and if your teams blue crystal gets taken down, you get a minus on the damage output of that magic /mana type... making your team have to work a little harder, and organize a little better to win (just ideas here, hoping to see people reply with ideas of their own and input)
I would like to point out that player class balance in these situations is not as much of an issue the way it is in other MMO PvP for instance where player classes all being balanced seems to be very important. In Pantheon, Battle of Honor is more about utilizing the classes abliities and having the right combination of healer/tank/DPS and crowd control to win as opposed to winning via class balance and pure all out DPS output, and in the long run, it's about working together as a team and understanding that running out alone all cowboy will only lose battles. Guilds have to work as a team to win, not just rely on class balancing and DPS output for a victory
Secondly, I know player housing is greatly desired, but it is not coming anytime soon and in the meantime I would like to suggest something else that is easier to implement, and might hold everyone over until player housing can be a thing: Guild halls butwith a personal touch - your own small room like an INN in skyrim or something.
In other MMO's, the guild halls are really awesome, some more than others of course. Rift did a decent job of allowing ppl to have, create and decorate their guild halls and properties, and some of the results were visually stunning!!
- Guild hall should be large enough to host events etc, would be instanced
- Guild halls would host the guilds achievements, maybe in the form of trophies to indicate content conquered etc?
- Guild halls could provide guild members with their own "room" so to speak with lockable door and a small bed, shellf to store some decorative items maybe, small table... not player housing, but a place to call "home" and hang your hat and sleep so to speak. Players logging out in their "room" would get a tiny bit more rested exp bonus than say logging out just anywhere in the world, and if halfway across the world you can rent a room from a city NPC Inn for the night to get similar rested EXP bonus maybe but you'd always get a tiny bit more if rest is at "home".
- Guild halls could host music, and actual interactive NPC's in order to hold guild events with more meaning than players standing in a room with nothing else happening that is relevant... guilds could hold Ballroom Dance events, host mini one vs one battle competitions... possibilities are kinda endless, and the event room could be modular to be easily decorated for ballroom vs battle by selecting and hitting one button for ballroom vs battle etc and the game would automatically change the interior of the room to suit your event needs. I know some players expressed interest in marriage etc...
- Guilds could have a choice of guild hall type, choose from one of maybe 4 or 5 or more halls, and even make halls modular and in sections that can be put together easily, like lego in a way, so you can "make" your own guild hall by getting the main part and adding on whatever you want to your guild hall, so that all guild halls are not looking identical to others.
- One of the things I would like to suggest is an idea from another game, where you could have players host an event, and players took on the role of DJ for instance and played/streamed actual music from their home that they own in game to have social events and gatherings, and something to do when not EXPing or raiding. This would require dance animations that are more than a few seconds in length or are loopable etc and to avoid legal battle, in-game music may need to be created (something I am sure the musicians of Terminus would love to contribute!) Even something similar to this is easily created and enjoyable (these two brothers have been churning out these tracks like mad)
- Guild halls could also have a guildhall trading/for sale board, specific to their guild ) ie friend prices as opposed to gouge prices from someone you do not know well in game at all
The possibility for player created content here is huge too imo... Pantheon, put us to work helping you guys! There are tons of us wanting to help I am sure however we can, whether contributing models, skins or ideas
So, some form of territory battles and some kind of guild hall w/ a mini version of player housing are two ideas that I personally would love to see implemented into the game in some form or another. I'd also like to see some of the buildings in Pantheon be more than just a place that looks like a tavern but is really just a place no one ever spends time in like all other MMO's. City buildings can and should be more than just decoration imo. Part of what makes things like this work in MMO's is the customization, allowing for personal touches. If every class always has the same stupid dance animation, or the same armor and same weapons, what fun is that... I think players want to have some degree of control over how unique their character and physical actions/ interactions in game in order to feel like the game is worth investing time into
Hoping others will contribute ideas to this and point out the pros and cons of the suggestions too.
Thanks for reading!
- Portalgun
(Edited to correct grammar issues)
PWI Territory Wars Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z05IJnnjQzY
Well I did like the idea of FFXI's Ballista. A PvP based ball game. Though if there were something like this I would like to see a better implementation. And it wouldnt necessarily need to be PvP so much as team oriented competiton in the form of a ball game. I would want it to be unique though, with its own spin not based on football or baseball, etc. Oh and being able to gamble over it would be welcome as well, but make that all player based. If people wanted to do it then they should do it for fun or for bets but not because the game gives you prize money or xp or anything.
A sport might be cool. In the Sword of Truth series they play Ja'La, which is a violent, rugby sort of sport. I'm not against mini-games, but I don't think I want war games. Let them be sports, races, tavern games (still prefer this), and let the rewards (if there are rewards) only be useful for the mini-game...no costumes or whatever to be worn in the actual game.
FFXIV has regular events. Maybe as often as every few months. Almost without exception they can be completed in 30 minutes and give nothing but cosmetic rewards. That is a wonderful example to follow .....not.
Events are a wonderful distraction and can keep many people very busy if done well. Most older games use events to give people something to do. Rewards don't have to have great experience or gear rewards but typically in Western games they do give something other than purely cosmetic benefits.
Mini-games can be very good. One of my favorite parts of the old Might and Magic games was the card game based loosly on Magic the Gathering. And the stae of the art has advanced a bit since the 1980s.
What do you guys think of events that surround real-life holidays like Halloween and Christmas? How, if at all, would you like to see these celebrated in Terminus? Should they be similar to real life or should they be a totally unique in-game holiday that just happens to be celebrated at the same time as a holiday in real life? Should there be unique gear that can only be acquired through partaking in these holiday events?
Bazgrim I posted a lore justification in a different topic for why such earth holidays would be weird to fit in, which I'll just repost here:
There are 2 two-week celebrations that we know of so far, for what it's worth, and they are vastly different. I would assume the races (especially ones not morally aligned) will have different holiday schedules.
The first is from the Dark Myr, known as "The Day of Testimonies", which 'celebrates' their transfiguration by the goddess Syronai into creatures who could survive on Terminus. It runs a week before and a week after the demarcated day. Honestly it's a lot of reading of testimonies of how much it sucked to come to Terminus (hence the name), so I bet the Dark Myr parties will be super fun.
The other is from Elven tradition, and is the chief holiday of their calendar. It celebrates the survival of their Mother tree, Heartseed, despite it being burned severely by the Ravaging Lord. It too runs "a week before and after" the particular day. Seeing as this particular event spawned two factions of Elves, I assume it will become a particularly important part of their holiday traditions.
It would be kind of weird for both the Elves and the Dark Myr to celebrate christmas but not their own holidays. That's not to say they couldn't do equivalent stuff, but I'd be way more interested in seeing something wholly new: races who actually feel like races, that have their own set of holidays. Maybe the humans could do christmas and halloween or whatever.
Im in favor of celebrating earth holidays in game. Its just not that big a deal to me. More importantly if they do have holiday events of any sort, make them fun and give them some meat. If there isnt any decent reward for doing them, ill probably skip and take advantage of less people at Named instead.
I'd rather they make Terminus holidays that occur at the same time as our holidays, but are completely different. I'm also fine with them making Terminus holidays that are completely detached. I'd rather not have some sort of twisted Christmas in December, a love celebration in February, and an altered Easter in March/April. Keep it separate, please. I think the festivals mentioned in the original post are just referring to the war game he described, though.
EDIT: Changed a word for clarity.
Bazgrim said:What do you guys think of events that surround real-life holidays like Halloween and Christmas? How, if at all, would you like to see these celebrated in Terminus? Should they be similar to real life or should they be a totally unique in-game holiday that just happens to be celebrated at the same time as a holiday in real life? Should there be unique gear that can only be acquired through partaking in these holiday events?
I don't mind just name them something different. And make them match up with the game lore somehow..so it isn't "real life" holidays so much as Pantheon...Terminus world holidays or events.
All for in game Holidays. Don't care if they match, but the themes help. People around the world celebrate different days of the dead, different spring renewal festivals, winter festivals, harvest festivals, etc.
Different cultures have similar events that did not grow from each other.
As Terminus was basically thrown together by gods, there is not a lot of shared culture. Probably not a lot of world-wide Holidays. So, maybe different realms may have festivals at different times. The elves have a spring festival, you travel to their area to celebrate. The Myr have their own festival.
Just make the holidays meaningful with the lore and local. but, I love special items.
Amsai said:I like the idea of Tavern games too. Especially Dice or Cards games would be awesome. I keep mentioning gambling but not sure if that is legal or if it would be illegal to expose minors to it in the form of a dev created activity?
I like the idea of tavern games too...whilst sitting waiting for your group to show up to go adventuring, or just to have something to do because you might be bored. :)
Tavern games would be really cool, and great way to meet new players/characters too and promote socialization.
I really also want to see places to be social, places to come and listen to Pantheon theme'd music by local traveling bards where players can hang out and socialize together, get in a tavern brawl for fun in the drunked brawl room of the bar where that sort of thing is allowed, play some darts or cards or even some form of trivial pursuit, the possibilities are many (btw, having travelling NPC bards that play different music styles and travel from city to city and are basically the "rock band" and local entertainment for set times throughout the night, and music set/composed for the time period would be really cool)
Picture your guild all together, celebrating, dancing and drinking various spirits after you've conquer difficult content together, listening to and enjoying the music of a unique and rare bard troupe that is only ever in town once or twice a year... everyone getting nicely and socially inebriated if they choose to (in game or out, or both, your choice!) Devs: is a mini game like tavern brawl do-able, and are there already plans in place to make buildings more than just a place to buy, sell or park in a chair? I'm really hoping that in Pantheon players can do more than just sit in a chair for pretty much no reason in a building like in WoW, or do an MC hammer dance loop for a half hour straight. Then again, maybe I should be careful what I wish for - anyone remember the gold-begging human, night elf, and dreanei females dancing "naked" on top of things in Stormwind for tips?
I 'm pretty sure a large percentage of the Pantheon playerbase wil be wanting to spend a LOT of time in game, I'll be one of them for sure, so seeing some new in-game content ideas to alleviate boredom and increase immersion and help the community be more social would be very welcome imo and well recieved by the players
A darts-like game affected by alchohol consumption.
A cool easter egg would be a fully fleshed out "kings cross" game (with a guise of the deceiver-like prize that makes you look like Kilsin. Or drops your CHA so badly that the train comes to you just form standing in a zone and clicking the mask).
Even a simple Hi-lo (war) type game that can be wagered with booze only, and if you win you can either buy the house drinks for a +.5 faction boost amongst the citizens or claim a special town drink.