Forums » Pantheon Classes

Class Development Banter

    • 79 posts
    May 30, 2016 11:08 PM PDT

    I am really interested in how class development will pan out in this game. I have been trying to research what I can, but most is just community speculation with not a lot of factual output to the community from VR.

    One thing that has me in continual wonder is the comment to the effect that abilities are learned not from a trainer but throughout the world; quest, boss, remote NPC, etc. Is it going to be something to the effect of you learn your first few abilities from a trainer in the initial tutorial to get started, then learn mid-tier abilities through basic combat, and upper tier abilities from exploration and difficult content?

    Most of us are accustomed to the at level auto obtain or at level go train.  Now do not get me wrong I like the idea where I set out in to the world to experience and learn as I explore and adventure.  That said what drives the player to obtain these abilities for their class is it just pure exploration wondering aimlessly scouring every centimeter of each zone systematically talking to every NPC, Killing Every Type Mob, finding each cubbyhole, and downing everything in dungeon without any rhyme or reason other than the search for ability unlocks?  Or, is there going to some sort of clue system that would inform the player in some way shape or form that they might want to explore said area, or venture into some dungeon, or go find that NPC Hermit on top of that far reaching mountain top? I am not talking sparkle line particle effects lighting up the path to your next ability unlock, but rather maybe a class lexicon of some sort that as you explore magically cyphers text into the pages with subtle hints clues and riddles of the teachings and learnings of long past ‘class’ personas that would serve as a vague guide to the player for unlocking new abilities.  

     

    Another thing that I have been wondering about is the class line up and how each will play out. Let’s take a look at we have:

    Ranged Classes: Cleric, Ranger, Summoner, Enchanter, Wizard, Druid, and Shaman (Range depending).

    Tank Classes: Crusader, Warrior, and Dire Lord.

    Melee Dps Classes: Rogue and Monk.

    This is just A typical of most MMO’s such as clerics stand in the back and heal and smite from affar, rangers lob in arrows, Crusader (paladin) shield/hammer tank, Warrior Shield/dw tank, Dark Magic Necro Tank Dire Lord, etc.  Now we know that Pantheon Is going to hold true to a lot of the old school classes functions Tanks Tank, Healers Heal, Support Buffs/CC’s and Dps, well does dps.

    That said are there going to be any new variations of the classes of old or maybe some deviation from the status quo?  For instance, I see some talk about Rangers being primary melee with their alternate weapon as the bow and visa versa bow primary and melee secondary which leads to two distinctively different play styles. Are the classes going to follow a strict structure style of play such as if you’re a ranger you shoot a bow from afar, or will there be such a system in place that will allow alternate play styles but still fill its primary trinity roll? i.e. One player can pursue the path of the bow and another player can pursue the path of the blade on his ranger each learning unique abilities for their own respective paths, but both filling the trinity role of dps.

    Similarly, the tank questions come to mind would it be possible if say the crusader was not pigeon holed to shield and hammer but could possible go a dps route toting a big 2h hammer?  Likewise could the Dire Lord play as DPS like a Hexblade or Dark Swardmage. I am not talking simply changing stances, I am talking basically a two tree system without the standardized WoW tree whereas the abilities you obtain are for that specific path and read and perform quite differently. i.e. the Dire Lord tank gets more tanky abilities, as opposed to the Dire Lord dps as they get more dps aligned abilities. The DL Tank can stance dance to a dps stance but won’t be as effective doing damage as the DL Dps, and likewise the DL Dps can stance dance to a tank stance but won’t be as effective as his counterpart DL Tank.

    I for one would much rather see two distinct paths rather than one class one path with stances. I think there should be a Ranger Bow Path and a Ranger Dual Wield Path. I also believe other classes should have similar type paths: Dire Lord dark magic tank or dark magic dps fighter off tank. Druid Support Offhealer/Buffer or all out Nature damage machine.

    With only having two obvious melee dps classes Rogue and Monk being out numbered 6 to 2 by ranged classes I would really like to see the tank classes have a DPS path to follow not just a stance change.  I wouldn’t mind either to see shaman have a tank form, for that matter.

    • 1892 posts
    May 31, 2016 5:47 PM PDT

    xaices said:

    I am really interested in how class development will pan out in this game. I have been trying to research what I can, but most is just community speculation with not a lot of factual output to the community from VR.

    Of course nearly everything is community speculation because right now development is in the pre-alpha stage were nothing is set in stone and no developer will release concrete details when release is nearly 2 years away.

    That said, if you did take more time to read the forums and search out Kilsin posts you'll find that much of what you wrote there is incorrect.


    This post was edited by Vandraad at May 31, 2016 5:52 PM PDT
    • 79 posts
    May 31, 2016 5:54 PM PDT

    Vandraad said:

    xaices said:

    I am really interested in how class development will pan out in this game. I have been trying to research what I can, but most is just community speculation with not a lot of factual output to the community from VR.

    Of course nearly everything is community speculation because right now development is in the pre-alpha stage were nothing is set in stone and no developer will release concrete details when release is nearly 2 years away.

     

     

    WOW, some good banter there about class development! Hey kid this isn't my first rodeo. I was simply trying to generate some class development discussion from the community. Some more what if's, this would be cool, I want's, and possibly some info no one else has seen might be good to contribute here. 

    • 592 posts
    May 31, 2016 11:52 PM PDT

    xaices said:One thing that has me in continual wonder is the comment to the effect that abilities are learned not from a trainer but throughout the world; quest, boss, remote NPC, etc. Is it going to be something to the effect of you learn your first few abilities from a trainer in the initial tutorial to get started, then learn mid-tier abilities through basic combat, and upper tier abilities from exploration and difficult content?

    Most of us are accustomed to the at level auto obtain or at level go train.  Now do not get me wrong I like the idea where I set out in to the world to experience and learn as I explore and adventure.  That said what drives the player to obtain these abilities for their class is it just pure exploration wondering aimlessly scouring every centimeter of each zone systematically talking to every NPC, Killing Every Type Mob, finding each cubbyhole, and downing everything in dungeon without any rhyme or reason other than the search for ability unlocks?  Or, is there going to some sort of clue system that would inform the player in some way shape or form that they might want to explore said area, or venture into some dungeon, or go find that NPC Hermit on top of that far reaching mountain top? I am not talking sparkle line particle effects lighting up the path to your next ability unlock, but rather maybe a class lexicon of some sort that as you explore magically cyphers text into the pages with subtle hints clues and riddles of the teachings and learnings of long past ‘class’ personas that would serve as a vague guide to the player for unlocking new abilities.

    We don't know yet how it will work exactly, but I'm pretty sure you won't have to "find" all of your spells. Some you will be able to buy (like in EQ). Others will be available as quest rewards, drops, ...

    And how will you know about the quests or drop locations? Most likely in the same way that you learn about them in EQ: Asking your fellow players, and if that fails, Google...I'm quite certain that even in alpha/beta there will already be websites with spell lists and info on where to obtain the spells. That said, I wouldn't mind if Pantheon would provide clues for the player as to where they should look for spells/abilities. Like the class trainer giving hints at certain levels when you talk to him ("I've heard that the people in zone XY need help against the goblins. Maybe you can learn a thing or two from the goblin casters while you're there"). I always find it a bit immersion breaking if I have to leave the game to search the web for info, so I would prefer if the game gave enough hints for a player to solve such riddles "in-game".

    • 193 posts
    June 7, 2016 3:35 PM PDT

    I would also like to see dual specialisation within the classes .  It makes possible to have 2 of the same classes in a group doing different things and having different strengths And weaknesses.  The only problem I see is that it makes class balance more difficult as you have to also balance within the specialisations.

     

    • 708 posts
    June 9, 2016 10:39 PM PDT

    I'm sure VG would be a good base to start from. It used the EQ method where you had to buy your spells and train at every so many levels. Then there would be dropped spells from mobs and bosses. Some classes such as the psionicist had to travel the world to find, I can't remember what they were called, but they were objects scattered across the world that the psi had to activate to receive that spell.

    And then I'd say the perception system will be one way to figure out how to get spells that can be found throughout the world. In VG there was another way you could get spells/skills and that was by fighting mobs and fighting them in a certain way. Each class (I think each class could get spells this way) had to find a certain type of mob and after fighting that mob for a period of time and with a specific ability they would be notified by 'flavor text' that something had happened and then they would get the skill. I'm a little fuzzy on this method since it's been a while since I obtained my bard's abilities this way so I may have some of the details wrong. But I'd say the perception system will be a big factor in getting new spells/skills.

    And the cleric, though a toss-up, has a good chance at being a melee class. They were melee in VG and could melee in EQ after LoY I believe. The ranger in VG actually had a rough time lol. At one point their melee was stronger than their ranged ability and they went through some crazy changes. But I'm pretty sure they will be primarily ranged with a good possibility of having some melee combat in their arsenal.

    VG had some of the best classes I've played in any MMO with EQ following right behind it so I'm certain that Pantheon's classes will be great. I'm sad to see the unique classes such as the blood mage, disciple, and psionicist gone but I have faith that the classes we do have will play great.

    • 2013 posts
    June 10, 2016 10:03 AM PDT
    @ Noobie
    That example of learning skills from a mob reminds me of a Blue Mage. Sounds fun.

    Also, give it some time on the unique classes. I think the traditional classes had to come first. And we know that Bard and Necro are down the pipeline. But I think eventually in expansions we will get the unique ones. But it might not be the ones from VG. Also I think a few of the traditional classes will have their own spin too. Like the hint from Brad that Druids will have the ability to control weather to a degree with localized effects that could pull double duty buff/debuffs.

    I also know at some point there was the dual spec thing but I dont know if thats on pause or if they did away with it.