The neutral hub in EQ1 was EC tunnel. I think EC tunnel was a mostly loved neutral hub throughout. Still thrives on P99
I say no to screwing neutral hubs. Why?
One... ouch. Sounds painful.
Two, whether dev created or player formed like EC tunnel, betting there will be at least one in game
- edited for being half awake and spelling it nuetral. time for coffee.
Portalgun said:The neutral hub in EQ1 was EC tunnel. I think EC tunnel was a mostly loved neutral hub throughout. Still thrives on P99
I say no to screwing neutral hubs. Why?
One... ouch. Sounds painful.
Two, whether dev created or player formed like EC tunnel, betting there will be at least one in game
- edited for being half awake and spelling it nuetral. time for coffee.
Well yah, in this context I would agree with you, but the tunnel was not an intended hub, just ended up evolving into what it is. My comment on not wanting a hub is more directed towards a city/town/village that is just neutral to make things convient for players to meet up all together. If players find another place like the EC tunnel and turn that into a neutral hub, then so be it.
Shucklighter said:Changing seasons, like Portalgun mentioned, would be awesome...not just in starting cities, but in every zone. Also agree that killable guards need to make a comeback.
In Saga of Ryzom they had changing seasons (European game) changed once every 4 days or so..spring, summer, fall, winter. And when the season changed, you could harvest certain rare plants, minerals that were kind of like a feature for that season. They also had migrating herds of animals, no static mobs standing around waiting to be killed. You could also create your own spells, combine them with some other spell to create something unique for you. Not expecting all that in Pantheon..just saying it can be done. Ryzom came out around about 2004 ish.
Portalgun said:The neutral hub in EQ1 was EC tunnel. I think EC tunnel was a mostly loved neutral hub throughout. Still thrives on P99
I say no to screwing neutral hubs. Why?
One... ouch. Sounds painful.
Two, whether dev created or player formed like EC tunnel, betting there will be at least one in game
- edited for being half awake and spelling it nuetral. time for coffee.
I loved that the EC tunnel was something that the players did...emergent behaviour if you will. :) Hope to see more of that come release.
Riply said:Portalgun said:The neutral hub in EQ1 was EC tunnel. I think EC tunnel was a mostly loved neutral hub throughout. Still thrives on P99
I say no to screwing neutral hubs. Why?
One... ouch. Sounds painful.
Two, whether dev created or player formed like EC tunnel, betting there will be at least one in game
- edited for being half awake and spelling it nuetral. time for coffee.
Well yah, in this context I would agree with you, but the tunnel was not an intended hub, just ended up evolving into what it is. My comment on not wanting a hub is more directed towards a city/town/village that is just neutral to make things convient for players to meet up all together. If players find another place like the EC tunnel and turn that into a neutral hub, then so be it.
This. Players will almost definitely eventually come up with their own common meeting spot. And that's good. But the devs shouldn't enable it. Kinda like how players will inevitably create their own zone maps and post them on external websites.
Portalgun said:The neutral hub in EQ1 was EC tunnel. I think EC tunnel was a mostly loved neutral hub throughout. Still thrives on P99
I say no to screwing neutral hubs. Why?
One... ouch. Sounds painful.
Two, whether dev created or player formed like EC tunnel, betting there will be at least one in game
- edited for being half awake and spelling it nuetral. time for coffee.
There is a difference between an emergent hub that players create and one that Devs create...the cities were still thriving with the EC tunnel as a hub, once PoK was introduced they became ghost towns
Sevens said:Portalgun said:The neutral hub in EQ1 was EC tunnel. I think EC tunnel was a mostly loved neutral hub throughout. Still thrives on P99
I say no to screwing neutral hubs. Why?
One... ouch. Sounds painful.
Two, whether dev created or player formed like EC tunnel, betting there will be at least one in game
- edited for being half awake and spelling it nuetral. time for coffee.
There is a difference between an emergent hub that players create and one that Devs create...the cities were still thriving with the EC tunnel as a hub, once PoK was introduced they became ghost towns
Very, very good point here re: PoK. As much as I thought it might have been cool to see a hub city, emergent player created ones are probably best and the devs could have NPC's start to also "show up" at emergent hubs and leave if those hubs are not populated, or come and go at random times? Kind of a variation on Shady Swashbuckler and his friends in EC tunnel
Riply said:Beefcake said:You will all need to build your faction with me.
Start now by agreeing to all my posts and sending me Peanut M&Ms and Chinese food.
It's Beefcake's like you who have ruined your own lands. You'll not ruin mine!
I have been begging for a Gnoll race in EQ and EQ2 for years. No one else will listen. I would be a Gnoll above all else.
Then I could run around claiming people are ruining my lands!
I like the thought of that but only for a few services...maybe to sell or trade between players.
I really want the bulk of services (banks, tradeskill work areas, class trainers etc etc) to remain firmly in the Racial starting cities. Make them matter to high levels as well as low levels. If banks are regional as they have said then have the branch banks only have small and limited storage space (you can store you region apporpirate gear there but not much else). My biggest concern for all this is the dead starting area problems most (or all) mmos have
CanadinaXegony said:Shucklighter said:Changing seasons, like Portalgun mentioned, would be awesome...not just in starting cities, but in every zone. Also agree that killable guards need to make a comeback.
In Saga of Ryzom they had changing seasons (European game) changed once every 4 days or so..spring, summer, fall, winter. And when the season changed, you could harvest certain rare plants, minerals that were kind of like a feature for that season. They also had migrating herds of animals, no static mobs standing around waiting to be killed. You could also create your own spells, combine them with some other spell to create something unique for you. Not expecting all that in Pantheon..just saying it can be done. Ryzom came out around about 2004 ish.
I would like to see bigger and active farms.
Games keep putting farms next to the cities, but like two cows. That could not support a city.
I would like to see moving farms and guards attacking you for killing their cows.
Sevens said:I like the thought of that but only for a few services...maybe to sell or trade between players.
I really want the bulk of services (banks, tradeskill work areas, class trainers etc etc) to remain firmly in the Racial starting cities. Make them matter to high levels as well as low levels. If banks are regional as they have said then have the branch banks only have small and limited storage space (you can store you region apporpirate gear there but not much else). My biggest concern for all this is the dead starting area problems most (or all) mmos have
I have no idea how I will decide what to put in each bank. I will need SPREADSHEETS!
Beefcake said:Riply said:Beefcake said:You will all need to build your faction with me.
Start now by agreeing to all my posts and sending me Peanut M&Ms and Chinese food.
It's Beefcake's like you who have ruined your own lands. You'll not ruin mine!
I have been begging for a Gnoll race in EQ and EQ2 for years. No one else will listen. I would be a Gnoll above all else.
Then I could run around claiming people are ruining my lands!
I would be a Gnoll over any other race ever...so sick of the over done cat people (is it okay to call them a bunch of Pussies in this instance?) and would love a canine based character for once
Sevens said:I like the thought of that but only for a few services...maybe to sell or trade between players.
I really want the bulk of services (banks, tradeskill work areas, class trainers etc etc) to remain firmly in the Racial starting cities. Make them matter to high levels as well as low levels. If banks are regional as they have said then have the branch banks only have small and limited storage space (you can store you region apporpirate gear there but not much else). My biggest concern for all this is the dead starting area problems most (or all) mmos have
Luckily the devs have stated that they do in fact have plans in place to mix content so to speak, so that there will be level 4's running around in the same zone as level 60's and both will be able to experience meaningful content. Empty starting and lowe level zones and overpopulated high level zones hopefully will not be as much of an issue as it has in the past.
Portalgun said:Sevens said:I like the thought of that but only for a few services...maybe to sell or trade between players.
I really want the bulk of services (banks, tradeskill work areas, class trainers etc etc) to remain firmly in the Racial starting cities. Make them matter to high levels as well as low levels. If banks are regional as they have said then have the branch banks only have small and limited storage space (you can store you region apporpirate gear there but not much else). My biggest concern for all this is the dead starting area problems most (or all) mmos have
Luckily the devs have stated that they do in fact have plans in place to mix content so to speak, so that there will be level 4's running around in the same zone as level 60's and both will be able to experience meaningful content. Empty starting and lowe level zones and overpopulated high level zones hopefully will not be as much of an issue as it has in the past.
I can see that definitely in dungeons and other zones, but it's harder for racial cities.
But, I hope thy pull it off. Too much detail in starting cities to waste.
Btw, there is a "joke" that probably not many know about that got left in EQ somehow in West Freeport
Go hit P99, cast see invis on an NPC, and yellowish-gold sparklies come flying out of their eyes. It's magical. Really.
Do this on one of the guards at the main West Freeport gate and and the sparklies come flying out of their crotches. Wtf SOE? lol?
To this day, I still wonder, was that an angry dev that got a last laugh in before leaving? Was it a mapping/modelling trigger placement mistake that no one noticed and once noticed, wasn't worth fixing?
I may never know /sigh
Portalgun said:Sevens said:Portalgun said:The neutral hub in EQ1 was EC tunnel. I think EC tunnel was a mostly loved neutral hub throughout. Still thrives on P99
I say no to screwing neutral hubs. Why?
One... ouch. Sounds painful.
Two, whether dev created or player formed like EC tunnel, betting there will be at least one in game
- edited for being half awake and spelling it nuetral. time for coffee.
There is a difference between an emergent hub that players create and one that Devs create...the cities were still thriving with the EC tunnel as a hub, once PoK was introduced they became ghost towns
Very, very good point here re: PoK. As much as I thought it might have been cool to see a hub city, emergent player created ones are probably best and the devs could have NPC's start to also "show up" at emergent hubs and leave if those hubs are not populated, or come and go at random times? Kind of a variation on Shady Swashbuckler and his friends in EC tunnel
Maybe, but I think a greedy general supplies merchant should be the extent of any types of NPCs in emergent hubs. Anything more (like banks, trainers, etc.) would probably detract from actual cities.
Sevens said:There is a difference between an emergent hub that players create and one that Devs create...the cities were still thriving with the EC tunnel as a hub, once PoK was introduced they became ghost towns
Some thrived, however many were ghost towns well before planes of power. On my server, Thurgadin became the main central hub during Velious followed by Freeport and Neriak because of their closeness to EC tunnel and both were replaced by the bazaar/Shadowhaven in Luclin. Misty Thicket, Queynos, Felwithe, Kelethin, etc. were pretty much a ghost towns by Velious on the servers i played on.
Portalgun said:Sevens said:I like the thought of that but only for a few services...maybe to sell or trade between players.
I really want the bulk of services (banks, tradeskill work areas, class trainers etc etc) to remain firmly in the Racial starting cities. Make them matter to high levels as well as low levels. If banks are regional as they have said then have the branch banks only have small and limited storage space (you can store you region apporpirate gear there but not much else). My biggest concern for all this is the dead starting area problems most (or all) mmos have
Luckily the devs have stated that they do in fact have plans in place to mix content so to speak, so that there will be level 4's running around in the same zone as level 60's and both will be able to experience meaningful content. Empty starting and lowe level zones and overpopulated high level zones hopefully will not be as much of an issue as it has in the past.
Remembering the griffons flying over level 13's heads in that latest livestream. Brought back memories of the Common lands and trying to hide in a hut to get away from that large flying monster after me, but he came through the roof and got me anyway! lol
Portalgun said:Btw, there is a "joke" that probably not many know about that got left in EQ somehow in West Freeport
Go hit P99, cast see invis on an NPC, and yellowish-gold sparklies come flying out of their eyes. It's magical. Really.
Do this on one of the guards at the main West Freeport gate and and the sparklies come flying out of their crotches. Wtf SOE? lol?
To this day, I still wonder, was that an angry dev that got a last laugh in before leaving? Was it a mapping/modelling trigger placement mistake that no one noticed and once noticed, wasn't worth fixing?
I may never know /sigh
Probably done on purpose, we always used to say that the "Devs were ebil" hehe
Sevens said:Portalgun said:Will be interesting to see if there will be a "hub" city like Stormwind in WoW, and how much draw to return to your starting city there is. I always felt returning to West Freeport as home when I first played EQ and felt a sense of belonging to a degree, and even pride for being Freeport "Born". If there is a hub city, it might be cool for the hub city to not be one of the starting cities, and instead be for non-player character race maybe, or a mix of all races cultures built into one hub city maybe?
I'm also seriously curious to see what will happen in Pantheon for trade and crafting buying and selling, if there will end up being an in-game equivalent to EQ's "East Commons Tunnel" with regards to buying and selling that is open pretty much 24/7. Dev's never saw that one coming, and to this day on P99 the tunnel is flooded with buyers and sellers at various times throughout the day and night which is imo, really cool.
I really hope there is NO faction neutral hub city. I dont want a bunch of stinky Mry making my beautiful tree city smell like rotting fish
I dont want them tooty frooty fufu elves and their silly twirly towers to build one in my rock solid stone fortress
Elves should go to elvish cities (at the most a couple of racial cities that are not KOS to them) etc etc
LOL! Sevens :)
I particularly enjoyed that as I started walking away from Felwithe, the little, scared, naked level 1 paladin that I was, even though there weren't many people right outside the tunnel, I could tell by /ooc chat that the zone was alive. Very shortly I had gained enough levels that I started wandering and found this awesome tree village. People were auctioning "CB belts and pads" at "orc lift" whatever that meant. And orc pawns started to be replaced by orc centurions! You all probably have similar stories :)
Anyway, I would love to see each race with their own city. Any "hubs" should organically develop, the way Kelethin/Orc Lift was the hub for little Elves, gnomes, and dwarves who wanted to do battle against the Crushbone orcs. Not too long after, some of my new friends took me on my first boat ride, and I was suddenly in a whole new place. I descovered Freeport, the EC tunnel, North Ro, Oasis (specs to dock! Cazel crushes you for 300 damage. You have been slain by Cazel. Loading... please wait. You have entered greater faydark... #%(@%^&@%&@!!!!) The EC tunnel was amazing. I'll never forget buying my Fine Steel Armor, 1 piece at a time as I could afford it.
Another idea for keeping racial/starting cities relevent could be something that I read in another topic, related to looted armor and weapons not being immediately usable. Maybe you would have to use a tradeskill/crafter to adjust for your specific race before you can use it, and something along those lines could necessitate having to go back to your home city regardless of what level you are. Just looted the Breastplate of Uberity from the latest raid mob? Well you still need to go back to your home town to get it tailered to fit your race.
Too many ideas... I can't keep them all straight in my head, so I will abruptly stop here. Oh, and yes faction work to be able to enter cities would be great, or maybe you're not KOS but you still need to work your faction to be able to use the services there. Ok I'm really done now!