It looks like we'll be having skill slots rather than a spellbook (and memorization of spells)... I could be proved wrong though!
I hope this doesnt dilute down the amount of spells available to classes. I enjoyed the large amount of spells I had in EQ1, the thrill of "quickly memorizing that evac/gate" when I didnt think it was needed.
Zandil said:
I prefer the VG style of having all my skills avalible, but thats just me
I agree!
I'm hoping to see no more than a dozen spells available at any one time, but then again I am very partial to the EQ way of doing things as I feel that is the one game in this genre that really did it right.(as much as I liked WoW from vanilla - BC it didn't have the same effect on me that playing classic EQ has, even though I never played EQ until 2011)
Happytrees said:
I'm hoping to see no more than a dozen spells available at any one time, but then again I am very partial to the EQ way of doing things as I feel that is the one game in this genre that really did it right.(as much as I liked WoW from vanilla - BC it didn't have the same effect on me that playing classic EQ has, even though I never played EQ until 2011)
Since you mentioned WOW and EQ...
Something for the developers to think about is that WOW had issues with ability bloat and they had to spend resources to change around class spells/abilities because there were far too many available.
Just look at my character on Final Fantasy 14. This was prior to the expansion (which gave a few more abilities) and I don't have room for any PvP abilities.
It may be worth the time to switch to a system that is better for the growth of the game (expansions).
The current UI looks like a blend of EQ and VG. I like it.
I am in favor of having to prepare spells rather than being able to open countless toolbars as shown in the screenshot above.
However, some abilities should not require being memorized; for example a sprint ability, or natural race based abilities like infravision and hiding. Those types of abilities should always be available. I'd like to keep preparation limited to spells and possibly combat abilities.
Zandil said:
I prefer the VG style of having all my skills avalible, but thats just me
I prefer the EQ style where you have to pick carefully/tactically the spells you wish to use for the comming situations. But thats just me :)
I`m a big supporter of having all my skill available all the time because you need to use your skills in the right moment or situation. Having me to pick the right/needed skills from my spellbook before a fight is a bit tedious imo . In the end you need to know what skills to use in a fight and when to use them to win the fight so having all my skills available is a big plus for me.
I would prefer a clean UI. That we have a mix of EQ and VG. EQ felt maybe to limited especially when you had many buffs as a shaman, but it also added lots of strategy which was really fun (how to customize your character to increase your survivability). That was really fun in EQ.
Suggestion:
1. At level 1 you have max 12 slots (instead of 8) which you can assign to short time buffs, abilities or attack/debuff spells and so.
2. While you press ALT-key 12 buff slots comes up instead, which only shows long time buffs (20-30min or longer time buffs which you usually use out of combat) which you can use or customize. You can only use them for longtime buffs.
3. Quests to open up more slots.
At level 25+ you can do a quest to open up 2 slots (so you have 14).
At level 40+ (higher level) you can do another quest to open up 2 more (so you can have up to 16 slots).
I liked EQs system. Although recently it has been relaxed quite a bit and you have now a lot more spell slots at higher level (through AA). Personally I think the original eight of EQ may have been a bit too few. But I definitely prefer not having to maintain multiple bars of hotkeys.
Maybe another idea (for spells): What if spells had an actual incantation (shown in the spell info), and you could type the words of that incantation in the chat (for spells you don't have memorized). The system would recognize the spell, and your character would try to cast the spell on your current target. Maybe with a high(er) fizzle chance, greater mana cost etc. since you don't have memorized it. So you would still be limited by the amount of spell slots, but an experienced caster could still cast a lot more spells quickly.
Zandil said:
I prefer the VG style of having all my skills avalible, but thats just me
Nono, me too :)
Boulda said:
Zandil said:
I prefer the VG style of having all my skills avalible, but thats just me
I prefer the EQ style where you have to pick carefully/tactically the spells you wish to use for the comming situations. But thats just me :)
Same. Was just talking to someone about this a few nights ago. We are playing some EQ2 TLE and we already have 4 hotbars of abilities, clickies, potions, sigils and items that must be swapped on a regular basis... and this is only the first expansion.
Its just excessive. Instead of combat being about knowing what items and abilities you need in a situation, paying attention and knowing when to use them, its about how good you are at memorizing 50 different keybindings. This also promotes whack'a'mole interface gameplay rather than actually looking at the game itself. I've grown tired of that sort of thing and honestly don't see myself getting involved in another game with that style of combat.
I prefer having a limited amount of slots, and like Elmberry's suggtion of quests to unlock a few more as well as an alt-key for buffs. Then mix that with Sarim's idea of typing out an incantation would be neat, though could also be easily macro'd thus bypassing the slot requirements at all so that may need some tweaking
I prefer limited available spells and skills. It not only encourages strategy, but also gives some reasoning to having more than 1 of a class in a group as each could bring certain abilities to the adventure, thereby encouraging co-operation between members.
Also, IMO, it forces one to better understand their characters strengths and weaknesses, and learn to mitigate those weaknesses based on the abilities they use.
Not every encounter or every class/race combo will find the need for the same abilities.
It's great that I have a grage full of tools, but when I go on a trip, I can only bring a select few. What will they be?
I need a game that gives me a reason to use all these again, add key modifiers, Alt, Shift, Cntl and i'm in heaven ;)
I would like a limited number of spell slots. I think it creates a fun dynamic. I think it's good to have a traveling spec, crowd control spec, etc. I think it makes the game more challenging and places emphasis on being in tune with your character.
For example, If you have 2 of the same classes on one team, one can go defensive and the other can go offensive. Unless, the game allows you to stack the same DOT's etc. I forgot how EQ did it, but I thought it was fun.
Hey guys, I have to be kind of vague here, apologies in advance, because this is the sort of thing we're implementing and tweaking as we speak. But I can speak to it in a general, more philosophical manner.
Pantheon has several types of what we internally call Abilities. Abilities can be prayers, spells, actions, stances, etc. Some Abilities will require you to 'mem' them, some requiring re-memming them after you use them, e.g. more like EQ or even MUDs. We like this because it requires thought and preparation prior to battle. And, honestly, we're not super keen on wall of buttons for people to just be mashing (e.g. the screenshot that was posted). BUT, some abilities, like stances and certain actions, will not require memorization.
What you are seeing in the screenshots with the UI is work-in-progress, but I can generally explain it: The side bar of icons are spells/prayers that have been memorized. The bottom bar is a general purpose bar where you can place memmed spells, other abilities, simple macros, etc. So it could conceivably grow large even though memorized spells/prayers are limited.
Let me know if that was helpful or if I just added to the confusion :)
Aradune said:
Pantheon has several types of what we internally call Abilities. Abilities can be prayers, spells, actions, stances, etc. Some Abilities will require you to 'mem' them, some requiring re-memming them after you use them, e.g. more like EQ or even MUDs. We like this because it requires thought and preparation prior to battle. And, honestly, we're not super keen on wall of buttons for people to just be mashing (e.g. the screenshot that was posted). BUT, some abilities, like stances and certain actions, will not require memorization.
That sounds great. That's how I was hoping it would be.
Aradune said:
Hey guys, I have to be kind of vague here, apologies in advance, because this is the sort of thing we're implementing and tweaking as we speak. But I can speak to it in a general, more philosophical manner.
Pantheon has several types of what we internally call Abilities. Abilities can be prayers, spells, actions, stances, etc. Some Abilities will require you to 'mem' them, some requiring re-memming them after you use them, e.g. more like EQ or even MUDs. We like this because it requires thought and preparation prior to battle. And, honestly, we're not super keen on wall of buttons for people to just be mashing (e.g. the screenshot that was posted). BUT, some abilities, like stances and certain actions, will not require memorization.
What you are seeing in the screenshots with the UI is work-in-progress, but I can generally explain it: The side bar of icons are spells/prayers that have been memorized. The bottom bar is a general purpose bar where you can place memmed spells, other abilities, simple macros, etc. So it could conceivably grow large even though memorized spells/prayers are limited.
Let me know if that was helpful or if I just added to the confusion :)
I love the variety. Old EQ1 style of memorization.. and something new (memorization after use).
Perhaps this is something you can't answer yet ---- But will we be able to rememorize spells in combat?
Silvanoshi said:
Happytrees said:
I'm hoping to see no more than a dozen spells available at any one time, but then again I am very partial to the EQ way of doing things as I feel that is the one game in this genre that really did it right.(as much as I liked WoW from vanilla - BC it didn't have the same effect on me that playing classic EQ has, even though I never played EQ until 2011)
Since you mentioned WOW and EQ...
Something for the developers to think about is that WOW had issues with ability bloat and they had to spend resources to change around class spells/abilities because there were far too many available.
Just look at my character on Final Fantasy 14. This was prior to the expansion (which gave a few more abilities) and I don't have room for any PvP abilities.
It may be worth the time to switch to a system that is better for the growth of the game (expansions).
In EverQuest, you had many skills an abilities. Safe fall, reposte, block. Some are active, some are passive. Dodge is a passive ability where as Taunt was an activated ability. Pantheon, like EQ will only have a small hotbar, with about 9 slots for spells and abilities.
Choosing which & how you play makes your Character.
Aradune said:Hey guys, I have to be kind of vague here, apologies in advance, because this is the sort of thing we're implementing and tweaking as we speak. But I can speak to it in a general, more philosophical manner.
Pantheon has several types of what we internally call Abilities. Abilities can be prayers, spells, actions, stances, etc. Some Abilities will require you to 'mem' them, some requiring re-memming them after you use them, e.g. more like EQ or even MUDs. We like this because it requires thought and preparation prior to battle. And, honestly, we're not super keen on wall of buttons for people to just be mashing (e.g. the screenshot that was posted). BUT, some abilities, like stances and certain actions, will not require memorization.
What you are seeing in the screenshots with the UI is work-in-progress, but I can generally explain it: The side bar of icons are spells/prayers that have been memorized. The bottom bar is a general purpose bar where you can place memmed spells, other abilities, simple macros, etc. So it could conceivably grow large even though memorized spells/prayers are limited.
Let me know if that was helpful or if I just added to the confusion :)
Brad,
I really liked the way the abilities/spells/actions bar was able to rotate in EQ; simply by a keyboard macro of say alt+1 for the first panel, then so on for 2-## panels, and then 1-10 for the varying slot use. Do you forsee this as being the same in Pantheon? minor and possibly to early to tell for sure I know, but just checking :)
Also, from what I've read on the site, are we only going to be able to 'mem' 10 abilities or stances at a time? per the living codex page? or is this something still being tweaked over time? Not looking to have a wall of skills like you stated, just curious as to this.
Thanks!
From what I have read on website, I was thinking that fights would come down to proper skills prepared. This would imply that not all of your skills or abilities can be ready at one time. I like this very much and am looking forward to this. I really think this will allow players to be unique in their class or stand apart from others if prepped properly given the varying conditions.
This is not a PvP game where key binds are critical to all your skills and abilities or how fast you can use them.