I thought about responding to Chaam's thread for the need from Crumbs, but as I was typing, my response became much too detailed... so here goes.
In the lull between releases - I wanted to raise a question. If you could having specific "crumbs" released during the next update, what would you like them to be?
I personally agree with Jason in Chaam's thread that I would like to see Combat Mechanics.
There are also many others that I would like to see as well that I believe could begin creating some insightful/productive discussion on these boards. I'll list some in no particular order, including combat mechanics:
1. Combat Mechanics
2. Class Skills / Spells / Mechanics (I.e. Hybrid exp penalty a la EQ)
3. Group Mechanics (Exp bonuses / splits / penalities / group size etc.)
4. Racial Bonuses and associated Exp Penalities/Bonuses (Think Human bonus in EQ and Iksar/Troll penalty due to Regen)
5. Death Penalty / Mechanics (Corpse runs / losing level, etc.)
6. Quests (outside of saying they will be meaningful and "no hubs")
7. General Gameplay Mechanics: Weight/Encumberance, travel/travel speeds, Faction/Faction Grinding, Mudflation preparation (itemization), etc.
8. Rights of Passage System
Plenty of others as well - basically I would like some of the vague gameplay elements fleshed out into what those elements mean specific to Pantheon. I think if these releases could have a few "wish list" type crumbs from the community it could spark discussion / feedback etc. and it would be a great asset to development as well as the community.
Perhaps create a developer sponsored poll a month in advance to see what the new aspect the community wants to hear about the most such as Combat Mechanics.
I'd be curious to hear others "wish-list" type crumbs and thoughts as well.
i will continue to post this, since i love the transparency with Camelot Unchained. http://camelotunchained.com/v2/pre-alpha-testing-checklist/ they have checklists with tasks they want to complete before alpha, this is the third check list. Notice there aren't any dates on it, but it's informative in that it gives us some small idea of what the team is currently focusing on.
I agree there Reht - I really like that Pre-Alpha Testing Checklist. I had asked for a roadmap/timeline during the initial development team fallout into the transition of the second, but I believe a more generalized checklist like you linked from Camelot Unchained would be more realistic and could temper unrealistic community expectations.
After looking at that timeline in more detail Reht and the first and second release of it, I like it even more. It not only provides more transparency as a whole, but a more behind the scenes look at development on what is being completed that may not be able to be "shown" in a game update. Those updates (checks) are still major milestones which take a lot of developer time. That simple listing of "To Do's" and the ability to check them off shows that work is being completed without taking needed resources away from continuing to produce future development.
Reht said:
i will continue to post this, since i love the transparency with Camelot Unchained. http://camelotunchained.com/v2/pre-alpha-testing-checklist/ they have checklists with tasks they want to complete before alpha, this is the third check list. Notice there aren't any dates on it, but it's informative in that it gives us some small idea of what the team is currently focusing on.
It is smart that they are taking the time to do this - it probably stops a lot of "I would like to see "x"" threads in their testing forums.
I have to say the link Reht gave does lay out a lot of information in a convenient viewing area. I listened to the podcast and every thing and I will be honest I am still not sure where in the development cycle we really are. I feel we see a lot of the individual pieces through our interactions but the way those pieces fit together is a little opaque to me.
As for what I would like to see, I am still very eager to see descriptions of the races. I feel that this is a crucial part to being able to expand the game to others. I do wonder what the reason for keeping the race descriptions back is? Do they want to release them with concept art? Does the team need more concept artist? Is the Lore for them not written? I can't say why but the feeling I get is there is some back story to each race already.
This is a complete aside but as a community do we know what the team needs? I know the devs probably don't want to be flooded with "I saw you need a -----. I am looking for work" but knowing in general the what the biggest bottle neck is maybe we can toss around suggestions? I believe I remember Brad saying something about purchasing default models or something like that. Is that something we could create a sort of wedding registry for where we could buy a piece here and there and donate it? Im just throwing stuff out there but it seems like there is plenty of passion here and until we have a little more beef to inspect and suggest with there are not a ton of outlets right now.
Cram9030,
That is the problem with videos and screenshots as they obviously portray some "work" has been completed, but it is hard to see outside of chat box text what exactly that work entails. Is it simply objects placed on a backdrop, are there group mechanics, combat mechanics implemented (basically are any systems, mechanics, etc. put into place)?
To me, that's where the point in game development becomes more "opaque" like you said as it could be that the mechanics have already been implemented, or maybe they haven't?
After looking at Reht's link more - I think Pantheon should basically replicate a similar model:
I'll use an example from the link Reht Posted:
Dynamically updating placeable collision using mesh or primitive shapes
While many may not understand what that means, it could garner good discussion and provide the community a behind the scenes look at game development without having to attempt to take development resources (time) into releasing screenshots or videos. Rather, resources could continued to be focused on development, while at the same time, temper community expectations for screenshots/video releases as they realize substantial (behind the scenes) work is being completed.
I would also agree that releasing race/class information is another important aspect to peak potential backer interest.
And, it may not be a bad idea once the new shop/subscription model/website is released to have Donation type goals in that if X dollars are raised it would help us buy X assets (or other development items). and make a "wedding registry" type listing of development items needed and give the community an idea of where the donations would be going too and a feeling of accomplishment once those milestones are met.
All of these are great ideas! I really believe the team doesn't need to recreate the wheel. The team should also ask for help when they need research conducted and have the community spend our time researching ideas for them. We have a ton of time we are all willing to donate.
Reht said:
i will continue to post this, since i love the transparency with Camelot Unchained. http://camelotunchained.com/v2/pre-alpha-testing-checklist/ they have checklists with tasks they want to complete before alpha, this is the third check list. Notice there aren't any dates on it, but it's informative in that it gives us some small idea of what the team is currently focusing on.
I was a huge Dark Age of Camelot player and I loved Mythic Entertainment. I've been following Camelot Unchained closely, and I also appreciate the checklist they have been doing.
Sorry I haven't responded to this thread sooner...at least 3 times now I've sat down with the intention of writing a new Dev Journal and each time I've gotten pulled away by one thing or another - but busyness is a good thing!
Let me say this though: I love transparency and I love accountability, and I believe both are necessary and very helpful for our team, both now and ongoing. So let me say two things:
1) Don't ever stop pushing us to be and do better as a Development Team, both in the quality of our work and the quality of our communication. That's why I love threads like this.
2) Raidan, thank you for this post. Reht, thank you for sharing the checklist/task example from Camelot Unchained as a potential solution. I like it very much and I'm going to try to design and implement something similar to put on The Keeper's Vault.
Lastly, we have some unbelievably significant updates coming up soon, so hang tight!
I appreciate the response Joppa - and I think if the transparency is increased by creating a checklist/task example similar to Camelot Unchained than item #1 will be able to be better accomplished. When the community is able to see what is being worked on by the development team and the expected outcome from that work, we will also be able to provide more productive and focused feedback.
And... looking forward to the updates!