@Savanja I was going to reply to a post you made about deer still using old graphics and have not been replaced yet. I figured it would be better to not derail that thread and made a new post.
Is there any chance the deer will be replaced with a more friendly animal to fight? Something like a fluffy bunny rabbit or a sloth, maybe bambi? I am joking to some degree but why have mobs like deer that don't even look like something that would fight you and more likely they would just die or run from you? Is there a chance these mobs are just place holders and in time will be replaced with more interesting and fitting creatures? Ar at least fade and never be fought again once you gain some levels?
With the system that you need to con everything to see its difficulty deer like creatures do works. But would it not be better if the mob graphics alone at least gave you a hint at there danger level? Should we not be invited into a world that tells a story in graphics not just text? We are far beyond MUDs, we have graphics now. If deer or other creatures that our eyes would say are no threat are going to be in the game can we at least put rabid in there name and make them look the part?
P.S. I forgot to give the thread a full name. I would edit if I could. You are welcome to change it as you see fit or I would suggest something like "Creatures graphics should match their level of threat"
Susurrus said:mobs like deer that don't even look like something that would fight you and more likely they would just die or run from you?
would it not be better if the mob graphics alone at least gave you a hint at there danger level?
deer or other creatures that our eyes would say are no threat
I'm not sure I understand your point. Are you saying the deer don't look dangerous because of their low graphic quality, or because they are deer?
I'd love to see the deer get an upgrade in appearance. I don't know if/when that is supposed to happen.
As far as real deer go, an adult deer has a pretty good chance to kick an unarmed human being's butt in a fight. A herd's dominant male could kill a human who didn't have a firearm. (At least the deer in the US could)
I am saying they don't look dangerous. If you listed all the animals on earth that you had any fear of deer are way down the list. Well most likely not on any ones list. A moose is at least known to kill humans and even attack people unprovoked replace them with that. I would truly be shocked to hear of anyone ever being killed by a deer let alone someone that is hunting it ending up being the casualty. This is not a game breaking issue but seeing as the graphic is being replaced anyways why not make it more interesting.
I would love to hear anyone's thought on why creatures like deer, rats, and other non-threatening animals are so commonly used in fantasy games and expect us to consider them a threat?
My current guess as to why creatures like rats, and deer are so common is it takes time to create new unique creatures. Not only the look but also the animations, sounds, names, description, etc. But if you use something like a deer so much of the work is already done. Granted the work is still there but the creativity is a lot lighter task.
But even then why deer, or rats, why not buffalo, or Komodo Dragons? Even some of the tried and true that lots of other games have also used like Elephant, Hippo, Rhino, Tigers, Bears etc. Many creatures that are known to us are threatening. Even some like wolfs that really are not much of a threat at least still look threatening and many people would be scared of them. I am guessing this is were some will point out being scared of a deer or rat can happen. I hope though people will get what I am trying to say.
I think the deer are for low level crafting/cooking stuff and skinning exp?
Also, deer kill more people in North America than any other animal...mostly in car crashes...but still...
I actually hit one on my motorcycle this year, not fun.
In the test sessions I killed a lot of rats, bats, spiders, boars, toads, snakes, deer and even some bears. I'm guessing we'll have some gators, hipos, tigers and plenty of more dangerous animals in higher area zones.
I know I played a game in the past that had deer but they would run if you got close or attacked it. The main reason to hunt them was for crafting if I remember right. This would be my preferred reason and behavior of creatures like deers.
funny I had not considered car crashes. Scary thought hitting one with a bike.
If all these types of creatures fade over time I will be a lot happier. I then think about killing level 60 plague rats in the Plane of Disease in EQ. I hope that is not our future for creatures to hunt.
What about toads and rats? Found a red rat in the undead camp that conned red. Seeing as we killed one of them I am guessing it was around 7 or 8 when the undead skeleton were 4-6. Not sure why a rat should be more of a threat then magical undead skeleton.
I am not trying to say deer or rats can not work. I would like to know why that and not something else. Why not something completely new and fantasy like.
I am not breaking the rules right I can talk about Alpha in this thread?
If we must have rats lets make them look the part make them look more like a R.O.U.S.
In the book, fire swamp R.O.U.S.s are described as "a pure rat strain", usually weighing 80 pounds, and running as fast as a wolfhound, about 40 miles per hour.
Now that is a rat worthy of a harsh planet.
Nephretiti said:https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/kentucky-hunter-dies-after-incident-with-deer/ar-AA1iYawP
The year the deer won.
This thread reminds of an old but TRUE hunting story from my father and his brothers. One of the brothers one year wandered away from camp without his rifle (bio break). He was down wind and wandered right up to a fork horn Buck on the other side of a large log (he could only see its head) He had his Bowie Knife on him and figured he could jump off the log and simply slit the Bucks throat. He jumped on the Buck and the Buck proceed to kick and gore the living crap out of him and their hunting trip was cut short as they had to pack up and take my Uncle to the ER.
Susurrus said:@Savanja I was going to reply to a post you made about deer still using old graphics and have not been replaced yet. I figured it would be better to not derail that thread and made a new post.
Is there any chance the deer will be replaced with a more friendly animal to fight? Something like a fluffy bunny rabbit or a sloth, maybe bambi? I am joking to some degree but why have mobs like deer that don't even look like something that would fight you and more likely they would just die or run from you? Is there a chance these mobs are just place holders and in time will be replaced with more interesting and fitting creatures? Ar at least fade and never be fought again once you gain some levels?
With the system that you need to con everything to see its difficulty deer like creatures do works. But would it not be better if the mob graphics alone at least gave you a hint at there danger level? Should we not be invited into a world that tells a story in graphics not just text? We are far beyond MUDs, we have graphics now. If deer or other creatures that our eyes would say are no threat are going to be in the game can we at least put rabid in there name and make them look the part?
P.S. I forgot to give the thread a full name. I would edit if I could. You are welcome to change it as you see fit or I would suggest something like "Creatures graphics should match their level of threat"
What is more fitting than itty bitty newbie adventurers killing woodland creatures in the forest?
Well first I am sure someone could make the case that slaughtering a bunch woodland creatures in the forest is not at all healthy. But this is a game and it works. You can play the game, kill things, level up, etc. But can it be done better is my question and I think the answer to that is yes.
Replacing the creatures like deer, rats, and toads with things that are ether known to us like Bears or wolfs that look threatening or a whole new creature that is unique to Pantheon helps immures ourselves in the world. It also makes considering our foes a little more intuitive. If a creature is a real threat to us having it look the part is important.
Your point about us still being newbie adventures is important though and if the plan is for Pantheon to only have us killing helpless little creature in the low levels and never see one again at higher levels a lot of my issues will be resolved. History tells me though that most creatures will be reused with a slightly different name, size, and color at later levels. Can you tell me I will not be killing a plagued rat at level 30?
I wish I was better with words or had more time to give a better argument. To be honest I am surprised the importance of having creatures look the part is not obvious to everyone.
Susurrus said:Based on the hardness of Pantheon and how fast they ramp up that hardness I would suggest removing all rats, bats, deer, etc. past level 4 then.
If you played EQ1, didn't you just love how rats would return constantly throughout all the levels across 25 expansions? Gotta love those level 115 rats!
Vandraad said:Susurrus said:Based on the hardness of Pantheon and how fast they ramp up that hardness I would suggest removing all rats, bats, deer, etc. past level 4 then.
If you played EQ1, didn't you just love how rats would return constantly throughout all the levels across 25 expansions? Gotta love those level 115 rats!
One of the main reasons I made this post is the hope that Pantheon will not do the same thing. Hard to be excited about my characters growth when I keep getting killed by rats.
chenzeme said: I don't have a problem with rats and bats at levels over 4 as long as they are bigger and/or look meaner. It does feel a little off atm. Make rats easier to kill but hunt in packs. Be imaginative with animals that, in the real, world die to a single chop of sword or axe. Get creative.
I am also fine with reusing them as long as they look meaner. If they are just a little bigger with a slightly different name that is not enough. Be inspired by princess bride and make R.O.U.S.s, that is a rat worthy of higher levels.
The rats should be giant or swarming if you just have to use that model for combat. The rats roaming the streets in Boston are larger than the rats in Pantheon :(
Show us some opossum sized rats or better yet just use a glowing eyed opossum. Players can fear the lights coming towards them at night.
I have no problem hunting bobcats if they get a model, but please don't have us hunt house cats or kittens.