Forums » The Rogue

Poisons

    • 596 posts
    April 4, 2017 6:49 PM PDT

    I believe Poisonmaking should be an important part of the rogues arsenal, I'm not saying they have to use poisons to be "effective," but i am saying that i think a rogue using poisons should be more effective than one that isn't, i also think it should be a rogue only tradeskill.  I liked what they did with the tradeskill in EQ1 but i would like it to be way more meaningful than they did as well.  It only make since to be because to me Rogue are your silent killers, sneaking in the dark and eliminating their targets without anyone knowing the wiser, and poisons are a prefect fit to this scenario.  Like i said if you don't do poisonmaking if won't make you completely useless, but if one is using his poisons you will be seeing a difference enough to maybe start doing it so you can be like him.  I also believe that the poisons you make aren't the one hit proc and that's it type poisons either, that really made them unwanting and just basically pointless to even think about learning the skill to begin with, but maybe like a 30 minute effect that randomly procced from time to time.  Any inside thought on this would be great to hear!

    • 86 posts
    April 5, 2017 7:25 AM PDT

    I don't have much faith in poisons - nothing personal devs. Either poison making will be worth investing in and required for every serious rogue to do, or it won't be worth the time dps wise thus worthless, or the effects will be too random to predict what the outcome will be thus they will be banned from most groups or raids. Poisonmaking will only be a rogue skill, though not officially confirmed, I am unofficially officially confirming it. It would be out of character for these devs to do otherwise.

    Personally, if they go back to one hit procs, I won't even bother in PvE. I only ever used them on pvp servers because of that. If they had some buff effect, I can see them being of greater value. Otherwise, spending a whole lot of tradeskill time and money on an extra 100-400 damage, or a slow, or a snare per mob encounter just seems like a waste when other classes could compensate. Since it's a rogue only skill, it isn't like you could sell poison to other classes...

    Or maybe you could. Maybe you could sell other classes poison for their weapons?

     

    • 2585 posts
    April 5, 2017 8:08 AM PDT

    Well we know that the Rogue's iconic ability is Improvised Alchemy, so I expect poisonmaking to be at least a part of a rogue's life. The description even says "the Rogue calls upon their knowledge of poisons and mixtures." We'll just have to see to what degree it comes into play. But I'd be willing to bet it'll be an option. If done well, it could be a valuable tool. It could be a lot more versatile than just "more dps."

    See https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/3136/improvised-alchemy


    This post was edited by Bazgrim at April 5, 2017 8:09 AM PDT
    • 199 posts
    April 6, 2017 3:21 AM PDT

    in EQ they balanced a rogues DPS based on poisons with an extremely random proc rate and required more than 1 rogue to maximize the proc (Tallon / Vallon stacking) that generates huge spikes or loss of dps....as long as that does not become the benchmark in pantheon I like poisons.

    Also it struck me as odd that a rogue could never apply poisons to other players weps for them (with a tradewindow type consent from the other player, or a pop up that says clean your blades or use the poison).

     

    *EDIT: Reference Tallon/Vallon 


    This post was edited by Warben at April 6, 2017 5:38 AM PDT
    • 596 posts
    April 6, 2017 12:42 PM PDT

    Bazgrim said:

    Well we know that the Rogue's iconic ability is Improvised Alchemy, so I expect poisonmaking to be at least a part of a rogue's life. The description even says "the Rogue calls upon their knowledge of poisons and mixtures." We'll just have to see to what degree it comes into play. But I'd be willing to bet it'll be an option. If done well, it could be a valuable tool. It could be a lot more versatile than just "more dps."

    See https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/3136/improvised-alchemy

    Yes, i read this class information almost 8 months ago and i was merely just putting it on the forums so we can all talk about it, i mainly just want to make sure they aren't one hit and done procs for the rogues this made them very unuseable in EQ for PvE instances, but some of their procs were very good, like some lowered the targets ATK, AC, STR, Attack Speed, lowering your hate, and all kind fo other things other than just damage, I would like for some of these to come back but without the one hit and dne procs like they used to have in EQ1 til PoP poisons came around but quickly died off and was useless again by like GoD came around.

    • 596 posts
    October 23, 2017 6:01 PM PDT

    anyone here any word if poisonmaking is going to be part of the rogue toolkit?

    • 2024 posts
    October 23, 2017 10:21 PM PDT

    EQOA Alchemist had an interesting thing that might work for this. Basically throwing poison bombs at the ground that explode. They could even have a variety of effects like AoE mez, AoE stun, or some could simply do damage. Ideally they'd have a bit of a cooldown so as to not be spammable.

    The idea of poisoning weapons is cool, but it'd have to be done really well to not be boring, and also manage how impactful it is. I'd rather not see it.


    This post was edited by Liav at October 23, 2017 10:23 PM PDT
    • 4 posts
    October 28, 2017 9:01 AM PDT

    I'd basically like for them to ripoff the vanguard rogue. Like how the poison and pickpicket sytems were symbiotic. Never played a better rogue. So much batman style utility. 

    • 322 posts
    October 29, 2017 8:39 PM PDT

    Just like an enchanter may enchant someone's gear or attack speed, rogues should be able to poison someone's weapons, IMO.

    It would make poisonmaking into an interesting trade skill/class ability, and make rogues more valuable in groups as well if the group wanted a constant supply of poison, in the same way it would want a constant supply of buffs.

    Producing antidotes that work by themselves or as regents to the classic "cure poison" spell would be even more interesting.


    This post was edited by BeaverBiscuit at October 29, 2017 10:44 PM PDT
    • 2024 posts
    October 29, 2017 9:08 PM PDT

    I liked being able to poison a group member's weapons (and eventually my whole group's weapons) in EQ2, but it was an activated ability as opposed to a tradeskill.

    If it ends up being a tradeskill, I might just roll a Ranger instead of having to rely on crafting to play my class.

    • 214 posts
    October 29, 2017 9:19 PM PDT

    Liav said:

    I liked being able to poison a group member's weapons (and eventually my whole group's weapons) in EQ2, but it was an activated ability as opposed to a tradeskill.

    If it ends up being a tradeskill, I might just roll a Ranger instead of having to rely on crafting to play my class.

    Actually it is both in EQ2 , all scout can use crafted poison except the bards. ( Assassin, Ranger,Swashbuckler,Brigand) Assassin are the one that can coat other's weapon with an activated ability.


    This post was edited by Rendall at October 29, 2017 9:20 PM PDT
    • 293 posts
    November 12, 2017 8:42 AM PST

    I liked, in EQ, how they tied the creation of poisons into another skill; in this case Brewing.  I think that poison MAKING should be a crafting skill like Brewing was, but that poisdon APPLICATION be a skill like other Rogue skills.  Poisons should also be tradeable/sellable so that Rogues who do not want to participate in the crafting saystem can purchase them.

    Something like making lower-level poisons from regular vendors and apprentice "brewers", mid-level poisons from "higher level" city vendors and journeyman "brewers", and high-level poisons from master Rogue NPC vendors and master "brewers".  I am using "brewer" in this case to represent whatever the crafting skill associated with it would be.

     

    Thoughts?


    This post was edited by Kalok at November 12, 2017 8:43 AM PST
    • 199 posts
    November 16, 2017 8:15 AM PST

    Kalok said:

    I liked, in EQ, how they tied the creation of poisons into another skill; in this case Brewing.  I think that poison MAKING should be a crafting skill like Brewing was, but that poisdon APPLICATION be a skill like other Rogue skills.  Poisons should also be tradeable/sellable so that Rogues who do not want to participate in the crafting saystem can purchase them.

    Something like making lower-level poisons from regular vendors and apprentice "brewers", mid-level poisons from "higher level" city vendors and journeyman "brewers", and high-level poisons from master Rogue NPC vendors and master "brewers".  I am using "brewer" in this case to represent whatever the crafting skill associated with it would be.

     

    Thoughts?

    I did like application vs creation being seperate, but always found it lacking that you couldn't critically fail an application and get the effect placed on you during the application.