Forums » The Paladin

Paladin Race/Class Picture

    • 2064 posts
    October 31, 2017 4:51 PM PDT

    The wards don't seem deeply ingrained in the daily lives of halflings or their culture though and I don't think they were gods, at least they certainly don't sound like it. It says "But the Ward of Flame was not charged to watch over the Kiri, rather his was to rule over a race beneath the surface of Hiryth." Which begs the question of: who/what gave Kiren that charge (and the other wards theirs). 

     

     

    • 269 posts
    October 31, 2017 5:36 PM PDT

    I dont disagree that is feels like quite a stretch and I also think the agrument has been over for quite some time regarding paladins. I simply offerred a possibility that I had considered; for what is worship but a devotion to an entity that offers hope?  With the recent reveal of the halfling lore, and a discussion somewhere somewhat recently(maybe a stream?) about how the halfling have a "borrowed" pantheon or a non-traditional pantheon, as well as the possibility that "somethings may be open to change as we go through testing", I remain a devils advocate for "entities that are the earth itself" still carry devotion. 

     

    Maidyn Clan are the spiritual heartbeat of the Halflings. They are easily the most reserved and contemplative of the race, seeking to find, follow and know the Six Wards that guide their people. The Halfling Pantheon is different from the other refugee races, and may allow for interactions with the Wards that are different from other races as well.  Maidyn Clan takes its name and motivation from the first Maiden Lyone, who is famous for outwitting Molsth and halting the effects of the curse, but was also a voracious student of Kiri history, Kiren the Ward of Flame, and culture in general. She knew her people would no longer exist in a few generation's time, so she dedicated herself to stewarding all she could about them. This base of knowledge is what allowed Lyone to be successful in defeating Molsth, and that is what Maidyn Clan seeks to imitate. [enter the paladin halfling possibility]

    • 84 posts
    October 31, 2017 6:26 PM PDT

    I've already decided I'm going to be a Halfling Paladin.

     

    Let's make it happen, VR!

     

    Image result for halfling paladin

     

     

    Look at those feet. Look at em'.

     

    Nature's Defender part II? 

    • 84 posts
    November 1, 2017 6:41 AM PDT

    And I've been thinking. Why does a Paladin have to worship a god specifically?

     

    Can't he get the exact same things from nature, or his leader?

     

    Also, why would the god have to be good for a paladin to work? Can't you be a paladin for an evil god? Afterall, isn't evil in the eye of the beholder? Look at Germany in WW2. Those guys had skulls and crossbones on their collars, and were putting people in the oven, and they thought they were the good guys. Same thing with Japan.

     

    I think we're missing a really unique opportunity to play with the idea of evil paladins.

    • 186 posts
    November 1, 2017 10:19 AM PDT

    Wow I never thought this thread would still be alive. lol  I still feel the way I feel about it. But no one else cares about the race limitations so... *shrug* One voice crying about it isn't enough to make a change. :) I'm just going to move on and deal with my crap human Paladin. 


    This post was edited by Verdic at November 1, 2017 10:21 AM PDT
    • 322 posts
    November 5, 2017 10:00 AM PST

    A lot of people have made the same arguments about "evil paladins" and the even better argument of "if a race can be a cleric and warrior, why can't they be a paladin?"  Regardless of logic or how many people have these feelings, the devs have said that they're fairly adamant on their class/race restrictions.  I personally hate dwarves and find humans absolutely boring in a game designed to escape reality or RP as something that you really aren't.  I really hope they make some statement or storyline that identifies why only humans and dwarves can be paladin...  maybe the dark myr diety their clerics worship doesn't like how paladins look.  -_-

    • 122 posts
    November 5, 2017 3:45 PM PST

    Darch said:

    A lot of people have made the same arguments about "evil paladins" and the even better argument of "if a race can be a cleric and warrior, why can't they be a paladin?"  Regardless of logic or how many people have these feelings, the devs have said that they're fairly adamant on their class/race restrictions.  I personally hate dwarves and find humans absolutely boring in a game designed to escape reality or RP as something that you really aren't.  I really hope they make some statement or storyline that identifies why only humans and dwarves can be paladin...  maybe the dark myr diety their clerics worship doesn't like how paladins look.  -_-

    I feel like everthing is coming together really well in this game's development. It looks better in each stream, and the explanation of game mechanics also become more intriguing. With that said, if I had any complaints about the game, the top 2 would be:

    -same as you; the current race options for paladin just feel really limited

    -cleric races (one of the main healers as well) has equally limiting races

    I have faith in them though. They have risen to each occasion and cotinue to show great progress with this game's development (those are the coolest halflings I've ever seen or read about among other things), so I hope when it's all said and done the race/class options will feel ok. 

    • 2064 posts
    November 6, 2017 9:28 AM PST

    Darch said:

    A lot of people have made the same arguments about "evil paladins" and the even better argument of "if a race can be a cleric and warrior, why can't they be a paladin?"  Regardless of logic or how many people have these feelings, the devs have said that they're fairly adamant on their class/race restrictions.  I personally hate dwarves and find humans absolutely boring in a game designed to escape reality or RP as something that you really aren't.  I really hope they make some statement or storyline that identifies why only humans and dwarves can be paladin...  maybe the dark myr diety their clerics worship doesn't like how paladins look.  -_-

     

    They explain it in the March Newsletter: https://pantheonmmo.com/newsletter/2017_march_loremaster/

     

    Another hot button issue was that of the lack of a Cleric or Paladin class available to our Elves. While the superficial answer of “think of them as wood elves, not high elves” makes sense to most veteran gamers, there is a deeper lore meaning behind that rationale. Justin explained that the races that were prone to produce Clerics and Paladins were ones that were deeply connected to their deities, and that relationship was one that was central to their daily lives. The Elves are a bit different in that regard.

    “While their pantheon is important to the Elves, their response to several tragic and divisive historical moments has superseded the way they see themselves. To a degree Elves have become more ideological than religious. While some races are separated into different factions based on which deity they worship, Elves are split between two extremes (Ashen and Ember) and the nominal middle called Lucent. Those division represent the way they think is best to protect and prosper their people. Is it interwoven with their worship? Yes. But faith isn’t the first-thought focus of their life. It’s fair to ask if that is an imbalance for them”

    It is also important to note that many of the lore based decisions on which race can be which class are also dictated to some degree by overall game representations and balance, and more importantly that just because something is currently so, doesn’t mean it can’t or won’t change in the future. Elves are a good example here, as while they currently don’t produce the pious classes, they may, through future events or interactions, develop a sect that takes up that mantle.

    • 14 posts
    December 14, 2017 6:23 PM PST

    If it hasn't been said yet.

     

    V/R should introduce a half-elf race that can be Paladin or Cleric.

    Give the option to start in Thronefast or Faerthale, to determine what classes are available for that half-elf.

    We will have the progeny system, and elves and humans producing half-elves is pretty common in most lore.

     


    This post was edited by Arlore at December 14, 2017 6:27 PM PST
    • 119 posts
    February 20, 2018 8:23 PM PST

    Iksar said:

    Also keep in mind that it is rather common that paladins tend to be one of the least played classes as the archetype doesn't tend to appeal to either tank players or maybe people in general compared to Warriors/Shadowknights/etc. I can only assume it is because the righteous/lawful good isn't as exciting, but also because they are a hybrid of warrior/cleric and people tend to like offense options over healing utility since you have a healer in the group anyway, and healers are far less appealing to most compared to DPS roles/skills.

    That is not based in any fact take a look at WOW which actually gave numbers based on their population playing their game.

    Paladins are the third most played class a far cry from one of the least played classes. http://www.warcraftrealms.com/census.php

    If the class is fun and engaging folks will play it if it is not they will roll up another toon.

     

     

     

    • 6 posts
    February 20, 2018 9:57 PM PST

    I remember seeing monks on a regular basis when Everquest came out and only humans could be monks. The first expansion added a second race and that was it for years without a problem.

    • 322 posts
    February 21, 2018 9:00 AM PST

    Cynwulf said:

    Iksar said:

    Also keep in mind that it is rather common that paladins tend to be one of the least played classes as the archetype doesn't tend to appeal to either tank players or maybe people in general compared to Warriors/Shadowknights/etc. I can only assume it is because the righteous/lawful good isn't as exciting, but also because they are a hybrid of warrior/cleric and people tend to like offense options over healing utility since you have a healer in the group anyway, and healers are far less appealing to most compared to DPS roles/skills.

    That is not based in any fact take a look at WOW which actually gave numbers based on their population playing their game.

    Paladins are the third most played class a far cry from one of the least played classes. http://www.warcraftrealms.com/census.php

    If the class is fun and engaging folks will play it if it is not they will roll up another toon.

     

    Paladin is my favorite class in almost every fantasy game, but I absolutely hate playing Dwarves and when given the option to be something other than Human in a fantasy game I want to "fantasize" that I am something other than what I actually am.  I actually originally played a Dark Elf SHD in EQ and RP'd as a fallen paladin not understanding the whole hybrid concept of necro/warrior.  I had my own sense of "honor" and ran to the defense of any ally that needed aid (and disposed of all who directly opposed Innorrruuk of course).

    The roles I enjoy most (in order) are Tank, CC, Healer.  I figured out that I appreciate the responsibility and/or ability of preventing other's from being injured.  I've also come to find that in MMOs everyone can DPS towards the end of the game... being able to mitigate or recover dmg taken is what seperates the players.

     

    • 119 posts
    February 21, 2018 1:28 PM PST

    Richter said:

    I remember seeing monks on a regular basis when Everquest came out and only humans could be monks. The first expansion added a second race and that was it for years without a problem.

    Originally in WOW you only had humans and dwarfs which could be paladins. At the time they were tied for 2nd for most popular class in wow along with Druid and Warrior i forget the third class they were tied with. So limit on type of race playable doesn't seem to stop folks from playing it. I am sure their may be some out there who will not play a human or a dwarf but its not a game breaking feature.

    • 119 posts
    February 21, 2018 1:34 PM PST

    Darch i normally play half elves if available in a game unfortunately pantheon has no half elves.... That being said when a game has no half elves i generally play dwarf or human dependent on the class i desire playing.

    If you want to be a paladin and do not like dwarfs god knows why some one would not like dwarves play a human. Or if their is a race you have your heart set on play a class which is available to it.

    • 67 posts
    February 22, 2018 8:38 AM PST

    So I've seen people use this excerpt from the March 2017 newsletter to disprove Elf Paladins.

    Another hot button issue was that of the lack of a Cleric or Paladin class available to our Elves. While the superficial answer of “think of them as wood elves, not high elves” makes sense to most veteran gamers, there is a deeper lore meaning behind that rationale. Justin explained that the races that were prone to produce Clerics and Paladins were ones that were deeply connected to their deities, and that relationship was one that was central to their daily lives. The Elves are a bit different in that regard.

    “While their pantheon is important to the Elves, their response to several tragic and divisive historical moments has superseded the way they see themselves. To a degree Elves have become more ideological than religious. While some races are separated into different factions based on which deity they worship, Elves are split between two extremes (Ashen and Ember) and the nominal middle called Lucent. Those division represent the way they think is best to protect and prosper their people. Is it interwoven with their worship? Yes. But faith isn’t the first-thought focus of their life. It’s fair to ask if that is an imbalance for them”

    It is also important to note that many of the lore based decisions on which race can be which class are also dictated to some degree by overall game representations and balance, and more importantly that just because something is currently so, doesn’t mean it can’t or won’t change in the future. Elves are a good example here, as while they currently don’t produce the pious classes, they may, through future events or interactions, develop a sect that takes up that mantle.

    This, in my opinion, is a mistake. This excerpt, instead, should be used to prove why Elves should be Paladins. Here's what we know about Paladins.

    Once a Cleric, the Paladin has a call transcending the customs of the Cleric Order. Led by her convictions, she sets off to carry out her own righteous judgment.

    You getting what I'm talking about? Clerics are an artifact of the Elven past. Before they came to Terminus, they were a quite pious race, getting gifts directly from their gods Aellos and Dythiir. So they had a previous Clerical tradition. Both the Ashen and the Ember are obsessed with the Elven past for similar reasons, with drastically different interpretations. This makes them natural practitioners of Shamanism due to their focus on their ancestry. Who's to say that this enormous cultural gulf between them did not have a response? The Elves do not put their Gods in the forefront of their minds, true, but neither do Paladins. Paladins are driven by their personal call, their mission, and pursue it with a zeal that allow them to access Clerical magic despite no longer placing their God as their highest priority.

    The Lucent Elves are caught between these idealogical extremes, and what little we know about them speaks to me by describing moderates that simply care less for the question. Why can there be no extremist Lucent Elves? Some of those Lucent Elves, back when there was still Elf Clerics, took on the mission to keep their fractured race together despite their differences. The strongest and most influential Lucent Elves that act as a balancing force between the Ashen and Ember. Those Elves, former Clerics of the Elven Pantheon, abandoned those strictures in service to this goal, and this order of Elven Paladins could have existed for as long as the Ember had sprung from the Ashen. The Order of the Lucent Tree are the root that keeps these two branches of elves from severing and dying in this unpleasant and harsh world.

    Elf Paladins VR. It makes sense. Paladins really should have a third race, and there's plenty of reasons why you can give it to Elves without also giving them Clerics.

    • 125 posts
    March 3, 2018 2:29 PM PST

    Verdic said:

    I've banged on this drum elsewhere, but I think it fits better here in the class forum itself. I want to get fellow Paladin's opinions on this. Is it ok that we only have two racial options - one of them being the jack of all trades, master of none race? We are unique that we only have two options. Thoughts?

    I'm new to this game/forum (joined about 10 mins ago). The first thing I did was to check out the PALADIN class /sigh

    I'm not surprised, disappointed - oh yes very definitely disappointed. Dwarves & Humans /sigh

    So its a human I will be /sigh

     


    This post was edited by Koala at March 3, 2018 2:36 PM PST
    • 16 posts
    March 6, 2018 8:36 AM PST

    In the truest sense of feeling betrayed, if there is no Elven Paladin, then I will be a Dire Lord and woe be to any Human or Dwarven Paladins ! :)

     

    You are officially put on notice VR LOL

     

    (before anyone gets bent out of shape, the post is MOSTLY farcical)

    • 6 posts
    May 24, 2018 5:25 AM PDT

    Alright Devs, I have a to point something out to you. What are Paladins? They used to be Clerics that have set out on a vengeance escapade but only the Dwarf and the Human are the races with anger issues? I think not! I feel that the Paladin races should definitely be the races that have both the Cleric and Warrior classes available to them. This only makes more sense doesn't it, from legends standpoint. Please, someone answer with what you think. I know others have also mentioned this story of the Paladin, but doesn't it make sense to add at least a couple more races to the mix?


    This post was edited by Encrypted at May 24, 2018 5:27 AM PDT
    • 563 posts
    June 13, 2018 1:41 PM PDT

    I love everything they've told so far.  I will apologize and eat crow over and over:  I originally criticized the writing of the lore but re-read it and fell in love with the story and the writing.

    The lore of the Halflings is my favorite.  One thing that is a little disconnected is the racial lore to classes.

    In this example, Halflings entire existence is defined by their curse and the arch-enemy of the undead.  

    They have clerics and warriors and the undead are their greatest foes.   So, it only makes sense that there should be halfling paladins.

     

    Mind you I am not a Paladin so I am not advocating for personal gain - just connecting the racial lore to the classes.

     

     

     

    • 84 posts
    July 9, 2018 8:43 AM PDT

    fazool said:

    I love everything they've told so far.  I will apologize and eat crow over and over:  I originally criticized the writing of the lore but re-read it and fell in love with the story and the writing.

    The lore of the Halflings is my favorite.  One thing that is a little disconnected is the racial lore to classes.

    In this example, Halflings entire existence is defined by their curse and the arch-enemy of the undead.  

    They have clerics and warriors and the undead are their greatest foes.   So, it only makes sense that there should be halfling paladins.

     

    Mind you I am not a Paladin so I am not advocating for personal gain - just connecting the racial lore to the classes.

     

     

     

     

     

     

    Well, shameless self promotion here - but I personally want to be a Halfling Paladin, so I guess it's for personal gain?

     

    This is a big opportunity the devs are missing by only having Human/Dwarf Paladins. (That's a very unfortunate thing to borrow from WoW, of all things...)

     

     

    At the very least, give us Halfling and Elf Paladins. Please.

    • 90 posts
    July 9, 2018 10:03 AM PDT
    Elf paladins pretty please! With personal gain out of the way arnt Dwarfs originally inward and greedy, perhaps not in this Pantheon's lore, however it is now my perception of the race and that was set along time ago, good luck trying to reinvent the wheel it's already round and there is no better shape for a cart to roll on than that, I do humbly apologize for the high-elf that keeps coming out in my words! Besides all that how holy can a dwarf really be?! If he's ale runs low will he LoH it? Or leave be the defence of his party for the gold!? If you desire to disbar them for the class I'd totally understand! >)

    It's been said that the eq Paladin was a poor portrayal of the class, I disagree entirely, I do agree it was the harder of rows to hoe but not without it's reward, the challenge was all the reward I needed, I got so much more out of it because of it /humble bow thank you EQ well done.
    • 90 posts
    July 9, 2018 10:12 AM PDT
    Please don't take my thoughts seriously, I just for the most part, I'm just slightly passionate and partial about the class, So sorry! Elf Paladins though right?
    • 90 posts
    July 9, 2018 10:13 AM PDT
    Jest stupid smart phone! I rolled an 18 on intellect once... shut up grammar trolls! ;)
    • 45 posts
    July 13, 2018 4:46 AM PDT

    Looking over the classes it seems that all the classes excluding gnome can be one of the special melee classes ranger, paladin, dire lord, or monk.  For class balance it seems to make sense for game play and lore.

    The exceptions being humans, myr, and skar.  The first two making sense due to the diversified nature and later who I believe may have a smaller play portion due to allignment and possibly weaker form.

    I like that the race/class combinations are limited.

    • 126 posts
    July 15, 2018 8:25 AM PDT

    While I feel like there should be at least 1 more race that could be a paladin, it's not really a deal breaker for me. My choice would be elf as the last race also.