Forums » Crafting

Which Games Should We Model Crafting After?

    • 80 posts
    July 9, 2017 10:19 PM PDT

    I don't know if anyone else would like this, but I would love to see a crafting skill literally take a year to master.  I want crafting to be something you have to dedicate a ton of effort to in order to be a master crafter.  Something that makes FFXI crafting feel as easy as WoWs!  

     

    Pretty sure I'd be in a serious minority on this one.

    • 1486 posts
    July 10, 2017 5:24 AM PDT

    Archatius said:

    I don't know if anyone else would like this, but I would love to see a crafting skill literally take a year to master.  I want crafting to be something you have to dedicate a ton of effort to in order to be a master crafter.  Something that makes FFXI crafting feel as easy as WoWs!  

     

    Pretty sure I'd be in a serious minority on this one.

    Totally agree. Crafting should take at least as much time as it does to level to max level as an adventurer and maybe even longer. I want a crafting system that is highly in-depth and complex and requires a significant investment in time in order to master.

    Crafting systems like EverQuest and World of Warcraft just don't do much for me.

    • 135 posts
    July 10, 2017 8:14 AM PDT

    Cromulent said:

    Archatius said:

    I don't know if anyone else would like this, but I would love to see a crafting skill literally take a year to master.  I want crafting to be something you have to dedicate a ton of effort to in order to be a master crafter.  Something that makes FFXI crafting feel as easy as WoWs!  

     

    Pretty sure I'd be in a serious minority on this one.

    Totally agree. Crafting should take at least as much time as it does to level to max level as an adventurer and maybe even longer. I want a crafting system that is highly in-depth and complex and requires a significant investment in time in order to master.

    Crafting systems like EverQuest and World of Warcraft just don't do much for me.

     

    Add me to the minority as well.

    • 15 posts
    July 11, 2017 10:08 AM PDT
    SWG crafting for sure but that requires vast resources that have individual stats that shift zones and time in spawn rather than 3Xgold bar and 1xsword hilt. I'm sure it's a complex system to put in place but it was its own part of the game as much as combat professions or anything else. It would be interesting to see an option like this to be in game. Just as in real life, not everyone is into being on the frontline. Rather than just playing a game I think aspects other than adventuring help immersion into the game as if you are an active part of it.
    • 2346 posts
    July 11, 2017 1:55 PM PDT

    Take some time yes..but let's not allow it to be 3 years to Master..(memory from Eve Online)   reasonable time to level your craft. :)

    • 783 posts
    July 11, 2017 5:44 PM PDT

    Archatius said:

    I don't know if anyone else would like this, but I would love to see a crafting skill literally take a year to master.  I want crafting to be something you have to dedicate a ton of effort to in order to be a master crafter.  Something that makes FFXI crafting feel as easy as WoWs!  

     

    Pretty sure I'd be in a serious minority on this one.

    I love it when people give some arbitrary length of time they expect something should take without taking into consideration how many hours per day/week the average person will play.  To take some inspiration from Einstein, time is relative, depending upon your frame of reference. So with your "it should take 1 year", the question is by who's measuring stick?  The person playing 1 hour a night maybe 2-3 times a week?  Or the person putting in 8+ hours a day every day without fail?  At best you need to come up with some realistic average then accept it without complaint when more people than you realize reach the maximum in weeks or a few months at most.

    The truth is this:  No matter how difficult you make something, some significant portion of the population will get to the end faster than invisioned.

     

    • 135 posts
    July 11, 2017 6:38 PM PDT

    I don't care about it taking a year, just that it be difficult, on par with adventuring.  I tend to split my time between the different spheres of the game, and enjoy the journey along the way.  When I get to maximum matters little to me, as hopefully the task of getting there will be hard enough, and engaging enough, that the time spent attaining max level will be as satisfying as being at max level itself.

    • 8 posts
    July 11, 2017 11:50 PM PDT

    Chimerical said:

    Cromulent said:

    Archatius said:

    I don't know if anyone else would like this, but I would love to see a crafting skill literally take a year to master.  I want crafting to be something you have to dedicate a ton of effort to in order to be a master crafter.  Something that makes FFXI crafting feel as easy as WoWs!  

     

    Pretty sure I'd be in a serious minority on this one.

    Totally agree. Crafting should take at least as much time as it does to level to max level as an adventurer and maybe even longer. I want a crafting system that is highly in-depth and complex and requires a significant investment in time in order to master.

    Crafting systems like EverQuest and World of Warcraft just don't do much for me.

     

    Add me to the minority as well.

    You can add me to,

    I think Crafting systems can't be done by everybody as in Pve every body can't finish the last donjon, boss, etc.. and those who finish take days of preparation or the best pvp players who must take the time to learn how to be at the top.


    Craft must be a 3rd choice, that if you want to get to the top it is necessary to leave aside the top Pve or pvp.


    Unless you have the chance to play 24/24 and there you will be able to do everything and maybe not even bore you

    • 13 posts
    July 12, 2017 7:48 AM PDT

    I enjoyed EQII orginal crafting. Hard, fun, and you could not make everything. The crafters became a communty of its own.  I died once making lumber. I laughed so hard that my tummy hurt and I had tears running down my face.  Good times.  The SWG orginal crafting was just as good and challenging. I did not play Vanguard (hides).  I disliked what happened to the EQII crafting. Dumbed down, everyone could make everything.  Made it so people no longer interacted with each other. I love going out with my guild and killing the bosses but I also enjoy crafting to gift my friends with special items.  It is not for everyone.

    • 52 posts
    July 13, 2017 9:16 AM PDT

    The only game i been crafting alot was FFXIV ARR was pretty interesting and i had all crafting jobs maxxed out, but i found Vanguards one interesting too, just didn bother much with it. EQ was pretty straight forward not much randomness as far as i remember, i kinda like crafting with various possible results, some can be luck some skill mostly skill and some luck is a fine thing to me. Cant say something bout SW Galaxies. Just wish the gathering could be made more interesting as well. So far it was not very interesting to gather materials.

    • 783 posts
    July 13, 2017 5:26 PM PDT

    If you want a crafting system that is truly broad and deep, look to EVE Online.  I'd bet much of their mechanics could be redone into a fantasy setting.

    • 25 posts
    July 15, 2017 2:43 PM PDT

    Greg Tech

    • 12 posts
    July 15, 2017 3:19 PM PDT

    I personally liked Ultima Online where especially mining was a social thing. People would stand next to each other at the rocky area and mine together.
    Personally I detest mining nodes. It becomes a race for people to get them and all it does is cause distress - especially if you're clearing an area of mobs to get the node and someone jumps in and takes it while you're fighting the monsters. I would like some sort of gathering areas that would change place over time - during one day or week it would be in the dwarf dungeon you could find minerals, and people could gather there and start chopping away at the walls or whatever the skill required. That way people would be forced to travel around the world and help each other clear the area so everybody could have a social event and gather resources until the area is empty of resources or the time is up and the location changes. It would also force people to get to know areas well for potential mining.

    I dislike the idea of pressing a button, watch a bar count up, and there you go - an item (or a failure). I would really like games to be more inventive, although it could quickly turn into Swordsmithing Simulator if you went too far. Let players figure out how much heat is needed for the various items, when they have to be cooled down, what smithing technique to use, let them share this info, etc. The reactive crafting of EQ 2 was perhaps on the right way, but still just a "press the correct button for this icon NOW!". The fun part for me would be to make crafting an actual game in the game. If you wanna create a potion, should you stir first or shake, and stir clockwise or counterclockwise and how many times? Eventually you'll have made your own little ingame notebook about how to craft, and as every other mmo people will share these things with each other, some will want to figure these things out themselves and that's fine imho. One of the most important things about crafting, however, is to make sure all crafting skill levels will continue to matter, even when the server is flooded with the best items. For instance by giving all crafting skills the possibility to make useful consumables or very specific gear pieces with unique clicky uses or effects.


    This post was edited by Chalkstix at July 16, 2017 2:33 AM PDT
    • 5 posts
    July 17, 2017 9:20 PM PDT

    I love crafting, but there are a few things that will keep me from playing a game even if that games has good crafting. If there is going be gathering, I like FFXIV, nodes are not shared and sorta customed for each player.

    I hated EQ1 crafting, it was one major time sink, there was no logical path to follow that didnt involve tons of farming mobs for materials, it was a pain in the ass. Having to gather tons of materials for a few measely skill up points meant months of farming. It was a treadmill, No Goddam thank you. If you had 4 hours per day for gaming 3 hours was farming materials needed to level crafting. Thats a chore and not fun.

     

    Vanguard was good, SWG was meh, Rift was meh, FFXIV is kinda fun, it cant all be like Skyrim ;p


    This post was edited by DeathtoGnomes at July 17, 2017 9:36 PM PDT
    • 27 posts
    July 19, 2017 4:59 AM PDT

    I preference was EQ2 crafting system. I knew so many players who just crafted and messed around with their house. They even had best tables for it.


    This post was edited by Tristar at July 19, 2017 5:00 AM PDT
    • 1 posts
    July 19, 2017 6:44 AM PDT
    Would like to see SWG's crafting system, but considering this game is not a crafting focused as SWG, Vanguard's crafting would be my next preference.
    • 458 posts
    July 20, 2017 11:41 AM PDT

    LIF is heavy crafting if making up buildings, and doing down resources. Otherwise EQ had a decent crafting system many got used to.

    • 18 posts
    July 22, 2017 5:09 PM PDT

    The more i'm re-playing SWG(Emu) right now, the more I think that the resource system could be implemented in the Pantheon universe via magic.  Gnome-magic harvesters for minerals and such, player farming for plants and animal resources.  Shifting values every week or so and different resources as well as quality in different areas of Terminus.  Even if a 'survey' style skill was included it could be tied to mana/energy and doesn't have to display a map or anything, but can simply lead the person like a Dowsing rod, leading to higher concentrations.

    • 2 posts
    July 23, 2017 2:56 AM PDT

    Vanguard: Saga of Heroes - Liked the system for gathering and also the chance that half way through you would have a complication

    that you would have to not only solve or maybe not have a finished product but also plan for before you started crafting your item.

    • 4 posts
    July 25, 2017 6:53 PM PDT

    Hey all, forum lurker here! Crafting has always been a huge hook for me, I can remember a game called Runes of magic, and the system was kinda similar in BDO, where you always had a chance while crafting to create a better version of the item. I think thats important for a system, It makes sense that you have the chance to make a better version (Blue instead of green) of the item. Like in DND rolling a Nat 20. That being said i would agree with alot of people which is items need to die, Or have the chance of dieing. Nothings worse than servers that have 1 Billion of X there for they are worthless , and why would crafters make them. It could be a duribility thing where once your weapon breaks its gone, I respect that some things are difficult to craft and people would rage if it broke and they lost it, So perhaps making a enchanting proffesion or somthing where one of the enchants could be unbreaking , so instead of buffing the weapon, or giving stats, you forgo the bonus's for always having the weapon. Which makes it players choice if they deem the weapon good enough to keep forever or if they'd rather have bonus's for awhile untill the item breaks. 

    On the item breaking line, maybe make it so you can repair them , however when they get repaired they lose a little. Whether it be duribility max, so once repaired it's duribility is 80 instead of 100 ? So the item will break but not right away, and the speed at which duribility is lost would need to be reviewed to see what is fair. 

     

    In recapp i love crafting and having the chance of making a better weapon the normal even if rarly, it drives economy for mats for people who want to grind for the proc. As well as i firmly agree the items should not last forever unless magically imbued to do so, it simply leads to a flooded market. 

     

    - See you all in the game soon (fingers crossed)

    • 51 posts
    July 28, 2017 8:24 AM PDT

    Strangely enough, I liked Ultima Online's crafting system. It was simple yet rewarding. You go out with shovels/pickaxes and a packhorse. Mine a bunch of ore. Smelt a bunch of ingots. Make stuff with the ingots.

    I feel like a lot of modern games try to make crafting too intricate. I don't really like running all over the map to get a small handful of materials or having to sort through a thousand crafting materials each time I want to make something. And rather than go through 5 steps / processes to make a single item, I would rather just make the item and let RNG sort out success or fail, whether it's high quality or not, etc...

    • 30 posts
    August 8, 2017 8:33 AM PDT

    I loved eq2 crafting, in the vanilla era of crafting (several combines to make one item) or now just the right mats and fuel and go to work. spamming durability and hitting progress on time. Knowing full well if you are not careful you could be damaged or even killed in the process.

    As i am sure VR doesn't want to make it overly fast to level maybe eq2's original system of using raw materials to create components that need to be combined into the item you are trying to make. 

    I just hope there is a bag or crate that is big enough, not just for mats and fuel, but the combines or other components. So we adventuring/crafting types are not having too many inventory problems.


    This post was edited by Ricky at August 8, 2017 8:34 AM PDT
    • 322 posts
    August 8, 2017 11:12 AM PDT

    I actually liked EQ1 crafting, especially in the early days when you didn't know what would combine into what.  Yes it was a chore, but that made it so that only the hardcore crafters would master their craft.  There was something to be said about being one of only two master Jewel Crafters and items were in demand.  Everyone knew these two people and for months, these were the only 2.

    Over time, things were dumbed down, made easier etc. etc. and every tom, dick and harriet was a master crafter.

    Personally, I would like a more intricate system much like the way vanguard was done.  Some say that complex systems like that might not work for people who are just starting out because of the learning curve but this game is not for everyone. There are many disenfranchised MMO players who are flocking to Pantheon. All these people have some experience with crafting and some will never craft and other will only craft.  For that reason, I think crafting should be as complex as possible but still meaningfull and fit the lore.  It should be hard to master and easily be as hard if not harder to level than adventuring.

     

     

    P.S You can stack 1,000 bone chips on Agnarr, the new TLP server..... I saw someone talk about having 37,000 bone chips.  And the bonechip quest would get you from level 1 to 29 by handing in 4000 bone chips.  Really?? Talk about easy.

     

    • 55 posts
    August 16, 2017 7:02 AM PDT

    I'm playing on Agnarr and love that they changed stack sizes to 1,000 for craftable materials now. That said not playing Vanguard (sorry only tried it for 10 days) I do not know how that system worked but I enjoyed EQ2 crafting the most because you could effect the outcome of your item or die from it. The only reason I like EQ1 crafting is because you could mutli-tradeskill on 1 character and has been the only game I have ever played you could do that on. It allowed me to focus on my main and only my main and people get to know the reputation of that person then the numerous alts of todays games. I do not like how EQ1 and WoW would put a item in a box hit combine and no matter your skill, trivial you had a percentage chance to pass or fail. Spending 12 hours farming materials on something that is trivial and failed 40% of your combines is a pita. So without having really tried Vanguard crafting, I would much prefer a mix of EQ1 (mutliple skills on 1 character) with EQ2 you actually craft it style system.

    • 45 posts
    August 19, 2017 6:18 AM PDT

    Great question. 

     

    I'd have to say SWG was the best for crafting. Followed by Vanguard in my opinion.