Someone posted something that got me thinking. I remember playing SWG and the towns seemed alive with players. Go into a cantina and there were entertainers, go to a hospital and there were healers. All preforming a service. I am not advocating that that system be copied, but maybe modified some.
If you are in a city and choose to log out at a specific place your character stays online doing some duty or task there that benefits the city and players in it somehow. Maybe healers can help to cure some form of res sickness in a healing hut, bards can sing and entertain in a tavern for some kind or benefit to others, crafters can open additional merchants locations selling similar things that an NPC would sell(they would not sell their own wares) and so on.
The point would be that this action would not directly benefit the player that is offline. Thats the hook. There should be no benefit given to someone thats not playing. The benefit would be small or moderate to the people that are actually playing. And the reason you would want to do this is because you want/need/appreciate it when others do it and once people stop doing it it becomes noticable," Hey why haven't there been any bards singing in the last few days?"
This could push a new social dynamic that would get people to help and participate even when they aren't playing. It would also make the world seem more alive. When you are offline youe character keeps their name. People will know who is helping out. You can gain a real reputaion from this kind of thing. Would also make the cities seem more alive and would give people a reason to got here perhaps.
Whatever the end result two things should be maintained I think. The effect that is generated should not be something that is required to progress, it should oly be something that is an additional benefit. And the offline player should not benefit from it other than knowing they are helping the comunity.
Oh this is what I posted about in the multibox topic <3 I'd love that because I miss my other other characters so much when I have a few of them :( It creates vibrant cities we can be proud of as we see our other characters help.
Other players in town can interact with your character performing a service . When you switch characters again you get a list of players that want to get to know you.Maybe give them the possibility to attach a love letter too <3
Fluffy said:Oh this is what I posted about in the multibox topic <3 I'd love that because I miss my other other characters so much when I have a few of them :( It creates vibrant cities we can be proud of as we see our other characters help.
Other players in town can interact with your character performing a service . When you switch characters again you get a list of players that want to get to know you.Maybe give them the possibility to attach a love letter too <3
Virtual Stalkers.....
But more seriously, I like the idea but I see an issue. What happens when 1000 people log off in one city? I would think things would get crowded fast.
I am going to make a prediction here. I think VR is going to try to build in a system kind of similar to this. They keep talking about how players will be able to log off for a short period of time and then come back and pickup where they were without their friends out progressing them and stopping what they are doing. At one point I read that they would have a system that would allow you to bring in an alt while you were on your main. The example they gave was say you need a rogue to lock pick a door, but you don't have one in group, but you do have an alt Rogue. They alluded to the ability to bring in your alt, maybe as a "merc" type NPC, to do the lockpicking for you. I believe they are trying to build a system that would allow players to logout for short periods of time, but their character stay logged in and in the group, again maybe as a NPC controlled merc, so that the rest of the group could continue on their way. This may be limited to 15-30 minutes or something, but this is the feeling I get from their comments.
It might be within reason for a system like this to allow for what you want to see done. Though I see potential for abuse, unless it is limited in some way to how many people can be logged off and remain in the group as a NPC.
NOTE: None of this is backed by any facts and is merely what I believe they are trying to do.
kellindil said:Fluffy said:Oh this is what I posted about in the multibox topic <3 I'd love that because I miss my other other characters so much when I have a few of them :( It creates vibrant cities we can be proud of as we see our other characters help.
Other players in town can interact with your character performing a service . When you switch characters again you get a list of players that want to get to know you.Maybe give them the possibility to attach a love letter too <3
Virtual Stalkers.....
But more seriously, I like the idea but I see an issue. What happens when 1000 people log off in one city? I would think things would get crowded fast.
I am going to make a prediction here. I think VR is going to try to build in a system kind of similar to this. They keep talking about how players will be able to log off for a short period of time and then come back and pickup where they were without their friends out progressing them and stopping what they are doing. At one point I read that they would have a system that would allow you to bring in an alt while you were on your main. The example they gave was say you need a rogue to lock pick a door, but you don't have one in group, but you do have an alt Rogue. They alluded to the ability to bring in your alt, maybe as a "merc" type NPC, to do the lockpicking for you. I believe they are trying to build a system that would allow players to logout for short periods of time, but their character stay logged in and in the group, again maybe as a NPC controlled merc, so that the rest of the group could continue on their way. This may be limited to 15-30 minutes or something, but this is the feeling I get from their comments.
It might be within reason for a system like this to allow for what you want to see done. Though I see potential for abuse, unless it is limited in some way to how many people can be logged off and remain in the group as a NPC.
NOTE: None of this is backed by any facts and is merely what I believe they are trying to do.
This is their Caravan system they have described. They haven't elaborated on it much yet, but I'm pretty sure Vanguard had something similar, so that would probably be a good place to start. So yes, in some cases, when you log off, your character won't necessarily be instantly removed from cyberspace, but there will be restrictions and I'm not sure it's exactly what the OP had in mind - I see several flaws with that particular suggestion, but it definitely does make it feel more like a living world if your character persists to some degree after you log off.
The primary goal of the Caravan system is to keep friends, groups, and guilds together. So another example would be: you're running with a group, but you need to log off for a couple hours to run an errand IRL. With the caravan system, you can ensure that when you log back in, you'll still be grouped and in the same area as your friends, even if they have since traveled to another zone or maybe even another continent. Your character may not be visible in the world during that time, but the game is still keeping track of your location and such. I don't really remember hearing about an afk Rogue player being able to pick locks and such, but I wouldn't be surprised. Anyway, this sort of thing will require a lot of balancing so I don't expect any details on it any time soon. But it's pretty safe to assume there will be something pretty similar to the OP's suggestion, but not exactly.
I like this idea. It would make it a neat idea for getting people into the towns and creating a hub for people to meet and group up before going out grinding/adventuring. This could also be integraded with a trade system, like you set up shop and can sell items while offline, as seen in other games. It would be cool to have options on where to camp, giving the character varrious benifits.
There are ways to solve the issue of having 1000s of characters logged off in the same spot; visually there are only a few characters there, or there is list you can bring up to find the best one. Doesn't really mater, the point being there are work arounds.
A good question kellindil how the game would handle 1000 people.
One way or the other the game would need a system to oversee the population when our characters have NPC controlled lives while we play another character.
Will cities have calm and busy moments that the population oversee system would need to take into account?NPC controlled characters blending into the scene during calm moments andduring busy moments
NPC controlled characters take a more active role in the city.Should the oversee system dose the amount of true NPCs and NPC controlled player characters?
Or would the population oversee system work towards maintaining the same level of NPC manning in a city at all times?
An NPC controlled player character that is still grouped could try to get on a caravan as soon as the population system notices that the rest of that group is located in another city?
Another way the population oversee system could manage population is if there would be a garrison sytem that allows a few 100 NPC controlled players to complete duties inside townbuildings.
If the max amount of players in an area is about to be reached,the population oversee system could retire a few NPC controlled characters assigning them to the type of building of their choice.
Aiding the research tempo at the university,boosting moral of the faithful at the monastery,boosting productivity at the farm or lumber camps
I could be on board with something like this, as long as there is no statistical or monetary or travel benefit to the player.
If its just to make the city/town seem more active and thriving, then it could be pretty fun. When logging out, maybe a window pops up with various town positions that might need filled. Bartender. Innkeeper. Blacksmith Apprentice. Bar Patron. Theatre goer. Piano Player. Garbage Man. Stablehand. Audience Member. etc etc.
You select one of these position and you become "Homercles (Garbageman)". Then you go about your duties for perhaps 1 or 2 hours. Then NPC You poofs.
The time duration is just to help alleviate the overpopulation of character NPCs that might be roaming the town/city.
When the time is about to run out for NPC controlled characters ,they could head to the tavern and poof there too,never to spawn inside
Gives it an authentic feel.
Characters always pop up and poof so it may be alright like it is. Do you think its worth the effort or not?
I wouldn't want my character doing anything while I was offline unless he was managing my store as a vendor for players to buy my wares, or tending to needs of my garden ect..around my house. I don't recall SWG using the players characters like that, but many players did go AFK while the character was dancing ect in the tavern.
I'd rather the players be online, and getting something themselves in exchange for their services, like faction or some storing up a temporary bonus to some skill, etc.
I remember SWG and the dancers in the tavern and healers in the hospital and such. It was an interesting concept that gave a reason to stop in those places. No matter how minor the "bonus" is or whatever it is, it gave people a reasont o swing into a nearby town and visit those places.
The more "live" non-combat interaction there is, the more alive the world will feel.
That's why I like the idea of players renting a stall in the maret place, and selling their wares, but they must be online. It adds a bit of life to the game. During non-peak hours, the market would be less busy with less merchants versus having an NPC merchants that stands behind the counter 24/7/365 (do they never eat, sleep or sh...) ;)
"Characters have lives when you are offline"
So basically like Toy Story -- when you sign out, your character comes to life? I wonder if people would like the offline version of my character better than when I am playing it... ;)
Don't know if anyone played Age of Wushu, but they had this system. It was actually pretty great, but was part of a bigger system that allowed players to kidnap offline NPCs and sell them on the black market (seriously).
How it worked is that there were jobs all over every city in every shop. If you went offline and a job was available or opened up, a character that camped there would fill the job. You actually earned a little coin offline depending on how long you were gone (kind of like rested experience). If you wanted to get an offline job, I think it was best to log out in a less crowded city (2 of the cities were really populated and centers of commerce). It think it helped keep the other cities more busy.
It was fun to see your alts and friends working in a shop or patrolling the streets while offline. Not exactly an amazing feature, but with the kidnapping thing it had a purpose.
HemlockReaper said:I wouldn't want my character doing anything while I was offline unless he was managing my store as a vendor for players to buy my wares, or tending to needs of my garden ect..around my house. I don't recall SWG using the players characters like that, but many players did go AFK while the character was dancing ect in the tavern.
I realize that in SWG this was not offline. I just saw another post in a different thread by Fluffy and for some reason what was posted resonated with me and reminded me of SWG. While I don't want to see offline vendoring of a players wares since I don't think a player should ever be rewarded or benefit from being offline, I do think some things could be done to benefit others and improving the servers community.
Fulton said:I'd rather the players be online, and getting something themselves in exchange for their services, like faction or some storing up a temporary bonus to some skill, etc.
I remember SWG and the dancers in the tavern and healers in the hospital and such. It was an interesting concept that gave a reason to stop in those places. No matter how minor the "bonus" is or whatever it is, it gave people a reasont o swing into a nearby town and visit those places.
The more "live" non-combat interaction there is, the more alive the world will feel.
That's why I like the idea of players renting a stall in the maret place, and selling their wares, but they must be online. It adds a bit of life to the game. During non-peak hours, the market would be less busy with less merchants versus having an NPC merchants that stands behind the counter 24/7/365 (do they never eat, sleep or sh...) ;)
I agree with this and would not want to add in anything that takes away from this. I think the two ideas can coexists.
Sabot said:HemlockReaper said:I wouldn't want my character doing anything while I was offline unless he was managing my store as a vendor for players to buy my wares, or tending to needs of my garden ect..around my house. I don't recall SWG using the players characters like that, but many players did go AFK while the character was dancing ect in the tavern.
I realize that in SWG this was not offline. I just saw another post in a different thread by Fluffy and for some reason what was posted resonated with me and reminded me of SWG. While I don't want to see offline vendoring of a players wares since I don't think a player should ever be rewarded or benefit from being offline, I do think some things could be done to benefit others and improving the servers community.
a player shouldnt have to be online to sell their wares, SWG had NPC vendors, many games have auction houses, other still have kiosks where guilds rent a NPC seller. What your suggestion is going back to sitting your character down in the middle of town ( usally AFK) while other players stare at the ground due to the lag, trying to seach the many many inventorys of players all sitting around town.
HemlockReaper said:Sabot said:HemlockReaper said:I wouldn't want my character doing anything while I was offline unless he was managing my store as a vendor for players to buy my wares, or tending to needs of my garden ect..around my house. I don't recall SWG using the players characters like that, but many players did go AFK while the character was dancing ect in the tavern.
I realize that in SWG this was not offline. I just saw another post in a different thread by Fluffy and for some reason what was posted resonated with me and reminded me of SWG. While I don't want to see offline vendoring of a players wares since I don't think a player should ever be rewarded or benefit from being offline, I do think some things could be done to benefit others and improving the servers community.
a player shouldnt have to be online to sell their wares, SWG had NPC vendors, many games have auction houses, other still have kiosks where guilds rent a NPC seller. What your suggestion is going back to sitting your character down in the middle of town ( usally AFK) while other players stare at the ground due to the lag, trying to seach the many many inventorys of players all sitting around town.
I disagree. I am all for what I stated above. We just have a difference of opinion. Not everyone agrees and it has been discussed in other threads. I personally do not want any offline actions being taken by a character that will directly benefit the player that is not actually playing at the time.. Just my 2 cents.
I was just looking for a way to have a meaningful addition to the game by the character that inhabit the virtual world. Actions that would continue after the player has logged but give no edge to the player. If nothing is being gained then they system can't be abused. And if its being used by the players they are doing it for reasons other then personal gain. It can only build the comunity.
Sabot said:I disagree. I am all for what I stated above. We just have a difference of opinion. Not everyone agrees and it has been discussed in other threads. I personally do not want any offline actions being taken by a character that will directly benefit the player that is not actually playing at the time.. Just my 2 cents.
I was just looking for a way to have a meaningful addition to the game by the character that inhabit the virtual world. Actions that would continue after the player has logged but give no edge to the player. If nothing is being gained then they system can't be abused. And if its being used by the players they are doing it for reasons other then personal gain. It can only build the comunity.
What your suggesting is impossible to do without befitting the offline player unless the character name isn't shown or changed to a placeholder, effectively making it just a typical NPC because if my character is a healer as you suggested then anyone who came in contact with my offline version would know that and add me a a Friend or know to send me an invite to their group when their short a healer.
HemlockReaper said:Sabot said:I disagree. I am all for what I stated above. We just have a difference of opinion. Not everyone agrees and it has been discussed in other threads. I personally do not want any offline actions being taken by a character that will directly benefit the player that is not actually playing at the time.. Just my 2 cents.
I was just looking for a way to have a meaningful addition to the game by the character that inhabit the virtual world. Actions that would continue after the player has logged but give no edge to the player. If nothing is being gained then they system can't be abused. And if its being used by the players they are doing it for reasons other then personal gain. It can only build the comunity.
What your suggesting is impossible to do without befitting the offline player unless the character name isn't shown or changed to a placeholder, effectively making it just a typical NPC because if my character is a healer as you suggested then anyone who came in contact with my offline version would know that and add me a a Friend or know to send me an invite to their group when their short a healer.
Thats the kind of thing that would make the system great. I guess I should be more specific, when I say no benefit. I meant you would not gain money, experience, skills, anything that could be exploited. Getting your name out and having that increase your chance to get a group is agreat benefit that is encouraged. And since this would not be a required thing to do, you can opt out and then not have people adding you to their friends list, and inviting you to groups as you stated.
Sabot said:Thats the kind of thing that would make the system great. I guess I should be more specific, when I say no benefit. I meant you would not gain money, experience, skills, anything that could be exploited. Getting your name out and having that increase your chance to get a group is agreat benefit that is encouraged. And since this would not be a required thing to do, you can opt out and then not have people adding you to their friends list, and inviting you to groups as you stated.
The financial gain from getting invited to more raids either though pure gold or gear is there. Unfortunately though it’s a benefit only for specific classes, namely those that have some medicinal or entertainment values. Do you foresee taverns with ring side seats to watch the local brawlers or tanks go at it? Or tables in the back with games of chance where any class can join?
Personally id rather just leave this stuff to the NPC’s, I don't want my offline character involved in anything that doesn't benefit me in ways I mentioned earlier, and I feel that the necessity of name recognition of this idea would actively hurt anyone not engaging in it.
I do remember hearing or reading about that rogue alt picking locks while the main character was still online, but I can't remember where. Perhaps that could be a benefit of progeny? Who knows?
Homercles said:
I could be on board with something like this, as long as there is no statistical or monetary or travel benefit to the player.
If its just to make the city/town seem more active and thriving, then it could be pretty fun. When logging out, maybe a window pops up with various town positions that might need filled. Bartender. Innkeeper. Blacksmith Apprentice. Bar Patron. Theatre goer. Piano Player. Garbage Man. Stablehand. Audience Member. etc etc.
You select one of these position and you become "Homercles (Garbageman)". Then you go about your duties for perhaps 1 or 2 hours. Then NPC You poofs.
The time duration is just to help alleviate the overpopulation of character NPCs that might be roaming the town/city.
I think this plan sounds pretty cool. You could have a list of positions around town that you could fill and you would choose one for your character to do for a couple of hours...maybe different classes would be eligible for different positions.
Dullahan said:Don't know if anyone played Age of Wushu, but they had this system. It was actually pretty great, but was part of a bigger system that allowed players to kidnap offline NPCs and sell them on the black market (seriously).
How it worked is that there were jobs all over every city in every shop. If you went offline and a job was available or opened up, a character that camped there would fill the job. You actually earned a little coin offline depending on how long you were gone (kind of like rested experience). If you wanted to get an offline job, I think it was best to log out in a less crowded city (2 of the cities were really populated and centers of commerce). It think it helped keep the other cities more busy.
It was fun to see your alts and friends working in a shop or patrolling the streets while offline. Not exactly an amazing feature, but with the kidnapping thing it had a purpose.
That sounds cool, too. When I played EverQuest, I would usually just leave my character sitting in a town somewhere while I wasn't playing, so I guess that helped areas feel populated...but obviously characters that were AFK were just sitting there or standing there.
I agree that I don't want the Bazaar setup where you can be a vendor while offline. I wouldn't be against something like a Ranger player character taking a shift selling Ranger spells to Ranger newbs at the Ranger guild while the player is offline, though.
I don't think many people would have a problem with this so long as the character was clearly offline and would disappear if the area fills up with too many actual people.
If anyone has a taste for a more active system though, you could do it like DnD and allow for things like book reading, skill training, finding things in the area, and building things. Done right, this could allow those who cannot play as much to keep up just a little better with those who can (assuming you can do these things better while you are actually playing).
