Forums » General Pantheon Discussion

Housing - is it planned to be a major part of the game?

    • 556 posts
    February 2, 2017 12:48 PM PST

    Honestly, I'd prefer for housing to not even exist. Every single game that has real housing has nearly no reason to go into town. When you can craft, shop, etc from your house then it makes the world less alive. There is no benefit to it unless it is really well done and offers a ton of custimization ala Wildstar. 

    • 1019 posts
    November 28, 2017 6:01 AM PST

    Enitzu said:

    Honestly, I'd prefer for housing to not even exist. Every single game that has real housing has nearly no reason to go into town. When you can craft, shop, etc from your house then it makes the world less alive. There is no benefit to it unless it is really well done and offers a ton of custimization ala Wildstar. 

    I'd prefer for it to not exsist as current games us it on most games.  Guildhalls and whatever its called in WoW, do, I agree with Enitzu, detract from a living world.  When all people have to do is zone to their guild hall and EVERYTHING ever needed is in there.

    But I still strongly believe housing, instanced housing should be in the game at release.  

    If Brad is trying to make worlds, it's a horrible world if you have no place to call home.  No place where you have a sense of belonging.

    I see no issues with instanced housing.  Look at IRL apartments, it's the same thing.  We all go in one door, do our lives, and all come out the same door the next day. To the outside eye, it's instanced housing.

    A couple of tricks would be, take Thornefast for example, Thornefast will have an Inn with 20, (who knows) doors to rooms.  The brothel (5 rooms), the Guard House (4 rooms), the Warriors Hall (10 rooms) 5 random large houses, 6 random small houses.   So if you take (using my numbers above) 50 door, err sorry, rooms x10 you have the potential to house 500 avilable rentable houses/rooms for characters in Thornefast.  (These numbers could be adjusted btw).  Limiting the number of "instanced" rooms each door has could also play into a real estate market (which could be the ever important money sink game developers need).  Charging 100 Plat as downpayment and 10 plat a month for a Large house and 1 Plat down payment and 1 Gold a month for a small Inn room is another money sink.  But it gives players a home.  I cannot overstate how important a home is in an MMO to give players a sense of belonging.

    This can be done in villages, other towns large and small.  If you have places that are logically available to have a room for rent, add instanced housing.  Importatntly enough though IS limiting it.  Giving or even having it available to every level 1 created defeats the purpose and feeling of accomplishing something.  But to ensure those who are investing their time and energy into the game, to ensure they can get a room somewhere, maybe they could do a quest.  

    Secondly,  to keep people from "owning" the housing market, make it so every extra "house/room" you own is exponitially more expensive.  These homes could be a place where we can "bank" some items other than the bank, or a place where we can hang cool items we find.  Cool sword you found, don't want to use it, but dont want to sell it.  "Mount it" on a peice of wood and hang it in your home.

    Finally,  World, (or server) events to build buildings outside of town.  If a town is over crowded and more rooms are needed, a world event can be started where players of that server, and whatever region it is on that server would undertake a quest by someone in that town to build a house or two just outside the walls, or in the nearby village.  Collecting wood, ore, materials and donating it would help to the construction.  Joining a mini game where you help in the construction could also be added.

    Once the house is complete, 20 more instanced rooms become available via that house.

    • 1785 posts
    November 28, 2017 7:34 AM PST

    Linking it here since this thread is active again :)

    Neph's take on housing is on page 2 of this thread:  https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/6938/farmville-in-pantheon/view/page/2

    Short version:  Housing is awesome, but housing areas should *matter* to players just like NPC towns do.

     

    Aaaannnnnd....

    Neph's take on guild halls is here (also on page 2):  https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/3308/guild-halls/view/page/2

    Short version:  Like vanguard, but expandable/upgradable

     

    @Kittik - EQ2 did something similar to what you are suggesting with instanced inn rooms, moving up to instanced houses that could be bought in major areas.  It was nice (because EQ2 did a good job with housing in general early on), but I still prefer non-instanced, in-world housing like Vanguard had.  That said, I could see instanced housing (inn rooms, apartments, etc) in NPC cities and non-instanced housing out in the world.  If that happens the game should have a "moving" system so that it's easy for someone to move all their stuff to new digs though.

    • 1019 posts
    November 28, 2017 7:45 AM PST

    @Neph,

    Did you ever play DAoC?  Ever zone into the area's that were made for housing?  It was horrible.  Think of the American suburbs.  Boring and listless.  It was just row of houses upon row of houses.  No mobs to fight, no reason to go into those zones other than to find your house or someone elses house.  

    This is my fear with what I've heard Brad say.  We'll basically have instanced houses, but all the houses will be in one zone.  Thats basically instanced housed that takes you completely away from the world.  EQ2 did it well at first by having the houses people use be in cities that peole lived.  (It got bad later, when houses had every amminity inside them) but still, I'd rather buy an inn room inside the city so I can use the city.

    • 1785 posts
    November 28, 2017 8:15 AM PST

    I did play DAoC but never did housing when I played it.  I played LOTRO and while the neighborhoods were pretty it was exactly as you described.  Booooring.  I currently play FFXIV and it's the same, although the playerbase tends to use housing areas for social events.  And I agree with you on EQ2's housing - at first, it worked.  It was as all the convenience items got added (especially for guild halls) that it started to pull people out of the general world.

    So, I feel like we're sort of in violent agreement about the problem :)

    Here's the text from the Farmville thread for my proposed solution (sorry, it's long):

    I would like to see this as a component of a much larger set of systems though, something that gives players the housing options they love and actually acts as a content generator for the game.  This is something I've wanted to see in an MMO for a long time, but no one has really done.  Since it would be an "expansion" type feature and something that would certainly happen post-launch, I am just putting it here as an idea for everyone to pull apart (or maybe make their own).  Here is a super-quick outline of what I'd really like to see.  I honestly could write pages on this topic if anyone is interested :)

    What Neph envisions/wants:

    - Scattered around the world, in unpopulated areas, are "marker stones" or something similar.  Someone with enough resources (money, materials, etc) could "claim" a marker stone and start a settlement.  Neph calls these settlements "Freeholds".

    - Claiming the marker stone establishes a set of central buildings with NPC services.  There's a town hall, an inn/tavern, and whatever other buildings make sense.  In addition, around the local area, housing plots become active where player houses can be built by players who have the appropriate materials/money/etc.

    - In addition to the housing, various resource sites spawn near the Freehold.  These resource sites are things like mines, logging camps, farms, and so on that are worked by NPCs and serve to sustain/grow the Freehold itself.  Players can interact with something in the town hall to see the status of these resource sites.  Resource sites may periodically be attacked by bandits/monsters, and when that happens they will stop producing resources.  Players will need to intervene to restore the resource site back to a functioning state.  If resource sites aren't functioning, the Freehold may gradually decline - shops close, fewer NPCs are walking around, the town hall falls into disrepair, etc.

    - Players can invest in and upgrade various aspects of the Freehold.  For example, they could invest in a guard barracks and tower, which would provide NPC soldiers to protect resource sites from attack.  They could invest in a smithy, which might add some NPC vendors to the Freehold (and better equip those NPC soldiers).  Expand the tavern.  Add a stable for fast travel.  Upgrade the town hall itself, which makes the Freehold larger and activates more (and larger) housing plots and more resource sites.  Resources can be contributed directly by players, and the "mayor" of the Freehold can spend resources from resource sites on projects as well.  Starting off, the mayor would probably be the person who established the Freehold initially, but (at least in my head), I'm imagining that there would be some sort of periodic election process amongst all the residents of the Freehold.

    - Freeholds can trade resources with other freeholds and can have faction standings with NPC groups and cities.  High faction might open up trading options to help Freeholds expand, or change the type of NPCs that spawn within the Freehold.  Low faction might make the Freehold an enemy of that NPC group, and they might get attacked or raided from time to time (in addition to random monster and bandit attacks).  Deciding whether and how to align your Freehold to NPC factions would be an important part of the system. 

    I think a system like this makes player housing not only a fun thing, which it arguably is just on its own, but actually makes it a content generator and helps keep people invested in the world.  It could easily be expanded to allow players to run their own shops, farms, and so on, which would be the social equivalent of what SWG had in terms of player cities.  Mechanically, I'm envisioning house construction working a LOT like Vanguard did (and I think Archeage), but instead of the housing area just being a collection of housing plots, the shared Freehold buildings are there to give residents a reason to work together and contribute to their community.

    There was a little more discussion in that thread afterwards.  Overall, the details can (and probably should) be tweaked, but I still believe strongly that if we're going to have housing areas, those housing areas need to matter - they can't be *just* rows and rows of houses in a pretty neighborhood instance or instances behind some door in town.  To put it another way, in real life, I own a home in a nice neighborhood (honestly, too nice for me, but I knew the person selling it and got it for a really good price).  I'm really not the best neighbor but when there's a snowstorm outside, I go help the people near me clear the fallen trees from their driveways.  When we had a bad power outage recently, I brought some candles and a battery lantern to the mother a few houses down because she was there alone with her 8 month old kid.  Every couple of months when I remember, I'll grab a box of donuts or cookies and drop it off with the security guards at the entrance to the neighborhood, just to say thanks for sitting there and filtering all the cars going in all day long.  So even for someone who can't even remember the names of the people two doors down like me, my RL neighborhood still matters.

    In a fantasy world, if I'm living somewhere, I should be invested in it.  It shouldn't just be a place I visit every so often to show off trophies and such.  I should be helping to defend it against monster attacks.  Helping to make sure the guards can keep order.  Helping to make sure the farms can work so that the tavernkeeper can brew that beer I really like.  Etc. :)

     

    • 200 posts
    November 28, 2017 8:36 AM PST

    What is the point of housing? I have never understood it...Will owning a house offer some sort of benefit or incentive to visit ones house?

    I can understand the benefits of a guild house. One centralized bank, meeting area for guildies, vendors, etc. but personal homes just seem odd to me.. 

     

     

    • 801 posts
    November 28, 2017 8:39 AM PST

    WarKnight said:

    What is the point of housing? I have never understood it...Will owning a house offer some sort of benefit or incentive to visit ones house?

    I can understand the benefits of a guild house. One centralized bank, meeting area for guildies, vendors, etc. but personal homes just seem odd to me.. 

     

     

    Time sync, storage personal, crafting, not everyone is into guilds. A group under maybe 12 might be ok as a personal home system.

    • 793 posts
    November 28, 2017 8:54 AM PST

    I did the house thing in EQ2, I think after i started it and set it up, I visited maybe 1 or 2 more times. It just seemed pointless, unless there is some advantage such as additional/shared storage or something, I personally don't see a point in it.

    • 200 posts
    November 28, 2017 8:59 AM PST

    Crazzie said:

    WarKnight said:

    What is the point of housing? I have never understood it...Will owning a house offer some sort of benefit or incentive to visit ones house?

    I can understand the benefits of a guild house. One centralized bank, meeting area for guildies, vendors, etc. but personal homes just seem odd to me.. 

     

     

    Time sync, storage personal, crafting, not everyone is into guilds. A group under maybe 12 might be ok as a personal home system.

     

    what is time sync? even with the other reasons listed, I still don't think those justify housing. just gives me the feeling I am playing the sims (I would think, never played it but wife did a little).

    It's like, great I got a house, now what? Sit in it? crafting I could slightly understand, but there will be plently of places for that.

    • 3016 posts
    November 28, 2017 10:12 AM PST

    There are some of us that like housing for crafting,  storing items we've achieved..mount that picture or sword, or axe on the wall,  books in bookshelves gotten from collecting ?  shinies out in the world,  something we can add onto.   It doesn't appeal to everyone.   Don't want a  house, don't have one? :) Also in Vanguard, you could build your own house or boat...with the help of other crafters.   Its yet another thing to do ingame,  with a bit of extra storage.  :)


    This post was edited by CanadinaXegony at November 28, 2017 10:16 AM PST
    • 3237 posts
    November 28, 2017 10:20 AM PST

    The housing system from EQ2 was stellar.  For one, it helped with player to player interaction.  If someone saw your goods on the AH, rather than purchasing from the broker, they could visit your house and buy it from your market board directly.  Being able to collect things in the world and then decorate your house was also really cool.  I personally never spent a ton of time doing it but I do remember visiting some of my friends houses and being pretty awestruck with how cool they were.  It was a great way for players to express their creativity in-game.  I remember seeing various competitions where the entire server would judge all of the entries to see who had the best custom house.  Things like that are great for an MMO ... not everything should be about killing/looting.

    • 1785 posts
    November 28, 2017 10:22 AM PST

    So housing, like crafting, is something that not every player will use the same way (or at all), and that is ok. But housing *can* do a lot of things. On the Surface, it is a neat side game where you can decorate a place, show off trophies of your adventures, and hang out and socialize with your friends. Housing and housing areas can also have utilities or amenities added, like crafting stations, banking, npc vendors, trainers, and so on. It all depends how far the devs want to take it.  Either way, for most players it is one of those things that they don't realize they enjoy until they try it :)

    • 1019 posts
    November 28, 2017 10:25 AM PST

    Nephele said:

    So, I feel like we're sort of in violent agreement about the problem :)

    YES WE ARE!!!

    Nephele said:

    Overall, the details can (and probably should) be tweaked, but I still believe strongly that if we're going to have housing areas, those housing areas need to matter.  

    In a fantasy world, if I'm living somewhere, I should be invested in it.  It shouldn't just be a place I visit every so often to show off trophies and such.  I should be helping to defend it against monster attacks.  Helping to make sure the guards can keep order.  Helping to make sure the farms can work so that the tavernkeeper can brew that beer I really like.  Etc. :)

     

    Why is this not just simply the Towns the game already has?  To make it work better, no town (other than capital cities) should have everything at the start of the game.  So all race spawn points should happen at not capital cities and people can grown their starter town to include more and more things.  It's where you were born, it's where you can live and it's where you can develop your sence of ownership, pride and belonging.


    This post was edited by Kittik at November 28, 2017 10:33 AM PST
    • 3016 posts
    November 28, 2017 10:26 AM PST

    Fulton said:

    I did the house thing in EQ2, I think after i started it and set it up, I visited maybe 1 or 2 more times. It just seemed pointless, unless there is some advantage such as additional/shared storage or something, I personally don't see a point in it.

    I was in mine every day when still playing EQII,  stored all my pets there...some of them used to kill each other lol.    Had a deity altar that I would feed old armor and weapons to for small buffs and faction.   Had all my crafting stations in there plus a couple boxes where you could access the AH from your instanced home.   

    Got a couple of "special" pictures to hang on my wall,   they were actually entrances to new zones to explore.   Had a kitchen where I "cooked" recipes for selling on the market.    Its a fun thing to do when nothing else is happening or waiting for people to log on.  And the general public could come shopping there,  to get a price discount if they bought directly from me instead of the AH.    This is instanced housing btw..probably won't see that in Pantheon I am guessing. 

    Oh one more reason I liked the crafting stations in my home....centralized crafting stations in a city,  created a lot of lag, and competition for the stations.   Some people hogged certain stations (botters?) and you couldn't get near them.  So no lag, no competition,  craft when you have time,  whilst waiting on your group or guild to adventure.  :)

     

    Cana


    This post was edited by CanadinaXegony at November 28, 2017 10:43 AM PST
    • 1019 posts
    November 28, 2017 10:31 AM PST

    WarKnight said:

    It's like, great I got a house, now what? Sit in it? crafting I could slightly understand, but there will be plently of places for that.

    Someone mentioned The Sims. Thats perfect, you know when you're kinda done adventuring for a while or want a break and want to play a differnt game, why not have that option of a different game, but it's still this game.

    I know many many people who LOVED spending hours upon hours decorating their houses in EQ2.  My house wasn't much, I didnt' spend as much time decorating it, but the time I did spend in there I enjoyed and was proud of what I had.  Plus, I always found it fun to go and remember how I earned that fancy throne chair, or that decorative fire pit.

    Plus, housing could be valuable without taking away community if its' where you could log out to earn an exp boost next time you logged in. 10 hours sleeping in your house (IRL time = 10% 2x exp boost.

    • 2752 posts
    November 28, 2017 10:45 AM PST

    Enitzu said:

    Honestly, I'd prefer for housing to not even exist. Every single game that has real housing has nearly no reason to go into town. When you can craft, shop, etc from your house then it makes the world less alive. There is no benefit to it unless it is really well done and offers a ton of custimization ala Wildstar. 

    Exactly how I feel about it. It thins out the players actually out in the cities and makes the world feel less alive to me. I've tried it a few times now and even in Wildstar it was fun-ish for a while (thanks to challenges you could place on your plot for interesting loot rewards) but it was ultimately pointless to me beyond being a convenience for crafting at the expense of the world as a whole. 

     

    I don't care too much if there ends up being housing but only if it offers no bonuses or convenience (crafting, AH, banking/storage) and is just a fun little art project for those who like that kind of thing. 

     


    This post was edited by Iksar at November 28, 2017 10:47 AM PST
    • 3016 posts
    November 28, 2017 10:57 AM PST

    Iksar said:

    Enitzu said:

    Honestly, I'd prefer for housing to not even exist. Every single game that has real housing has nearly no reason to go into town. When you can craft, shop, etc from your house then it makes the world less alive. There is no benefit to it unless it is really well done and offers a ton of custimization ala Wildstar. 

    Exactly how I feel about it. It thins out the players actually out in the cities and makes the world feel less alive to me. I've tried it a few times now and even in Wildstar it was fun-ish for a while (thanks to challenges you could place on your plot for interesting loot rewards) but it was ultimately pointless to me beyond being a convenience for crafting at the expense of the world as a whole. 

     

    I don't care too much if there ends up being housing but only if it offers no bonuses or convenience (crafting, AH, banking/storage) and is just a fun little art project for those who like that kind of thing. 

     

     

    I'm not going to be raiding,  but just because I won't be raiding,  doesn't mean that others can't.  :)  These little extras keep people involved in the world..to their own liking.  Crafting within a home instead having to endure the lag and competition in a main city (love you Vanguard but that lag cost me a combine or two)  I'll be exploring,  I'll be working on that Perception title,  not everyone's cup of tea.   But we can all play this game together,  some of us will be providing services,  others will be hunting down that uber unkillable Boss mob. :)   

     

    Cana

     

    • 793 posts
    November 28, 2017 11:05 AM PST

    CanadinaXegony said:

    Fulton said:

    I did the house thing in EQ2, I think after i started it and set it up, I visited maybe 1 or 2 more times. It just seemed pointless, unless there is some advantage such as additional/shared storage or something, I personally don't see a point in it.

    I was in mine every day when still playing EQII,  stored all my pets there...some of them used to kill each other lol.    Had a deity altar that I would feed old armor and weapons to for small buffs and faction.   Had all my crafting stations in there plus a couple boxes where you could access the AH from your instanced home.   

    Got a couple of "special" pictures to hang on my wall,   they were actually entrances to new zones to explore.   Had a kitchen where I "cooked" recipes for selling on the market.    Its a fun thing to do when nothing else is happening or waiting for people to log on.  And the general public could come shopping there,  to get a price discount if they bought directly from me instead of the AH.    This is instanced housing btw..probably won't see that in Pantheon I am guessing. 

    Oh one more reason I liked the crafting stations in my home....centralized crafting stations in a city,  created a lot of lag, and competition for the stations.   Some people hogged certain stations (botters?) and you couldn't get near them.  So no lag, no competition,  craft when you have time,  whilst waiting on your group or guild to adventure.  :)

     

    Cana

    ....Oh one more reason I liked the crafting stations in my home...  

     

    Like I said, if it provides some advantage then fine, but if it's purely cosmetic, then I will not make use it, that is not to say I don't think they should have housing.  :) And since I'm not typically a crafter, that is of no advantage to me, therefore I would not partake in that part of the game.

    In my personal experience that I personally (Even included this line in my post), didn't see a point in it. Others do, I understand that.

    My only issue with housing would be if it is open world, there needs to be limitations, or you end up with a hodge podge of player housing all over.

     

     

     


    This post was edited by Fulton at November 28, 2017 11:06 AM PST
    • 3016 posts
    November 28, 2017 11:21 AM PST

    Fulton said:

    CanadinaXegony said:

    Fulton said:

    I did the house thing in EQ2, I think after i started it and set it up, I visited maybe 1 or 2 more times. It just seemed pointless, unless there is some advantage such as additional/shared storage or something, I personally don't see a point in it.

    I was in mine every day when still playing EQII,  stored all my pets there...some of them used to kill each other lol.    Had a deity altar that I would feed old armor and weapons to for small buffs and faction.   Had all my crafting stations in there plus a couple boxes where you could access the AH from your instanced home.   

    Got a couple of "special" pictures to hang on my wall,   they were actually entrances to new zones to explore.   Had a kitchen where I "cooked" recipes for selling on the market.    Its a fun thing to do when nothing else is happening or waiting for people to log on.  And the general public could come shopping there,  to get a price discount if they bought directly from me instead of the AH.    This is instanced housing btw..probably won't see that in Pantheon I am guessing. 

    Oh one more reason I liked the crafting stations in my home....centralized crafting stations in a city,  created a lot of lag, and competition for the stations.   Some people hogged certain stations (botters?) and you couldn't get near them.  So no lag, no competition,  craft when you have time,  whilst waiting on your group or guild to adventure.  :)

     

    Cana

    ....Oh one more reason I liked the crafting stations in my home...  

     

    Like I said, if it provides some advantage then fine, but if it's purely cosmetic, then I will not make use it, that is not to say I don't think they should have housing.  :) And since I'm not typically a crafter, that is of no advantage to me, therefore I would not partake in that part of the game.

    In my personal experience that I personally (Even included this line in my post), didn't see a point in it. Others do, I understand that.

    My only issue with housing would be if it is open world, there needs to be limitations, or you end up with a hodge podge of player housing all over.

     

     

     

     

    Agreed Fulton...it was a royal mess in SWG..open world housing,  plunked everywhere,  standing vacant (because the players were mad at SOE and exited the game en masse)  and then they stayed away.   And those housing plots couldn't be had for love nor money.

        At one point they started blowing up the vacant housing...then they revised that,  and any account that had been inactive for years,  had everything returned to their inventory and bank slots to clear the way for newcomers.      Vanguard had open world housing too.    I'm in favour of instancing...but I don't think VR is going to do it that way,  at least not from what I've read over time.    *keeping fingers crossed*

    Cana

    • 281 posts
    November 28, 2017 11:23 AM PST

    Housing is of no real interest to me, outside being some extra "bank" space.  I did like in EQ1 much later in the game, that you could put up trophies from raid and other targets and get some small buff effects from having those trophies displayed in your home.  It made the accomplishments feel more real and gave me a reason to go to my house.  But for the most part, it is an art project that isn't really my thing.  But for those that like it -- great!

    As long as the effects are minor, I would like to see the mechanic mentioned above.  But I'd like even more for Inns and such to give "Rested" buffs that give incentive for people to hang out in Inns while LFG.  Again, nothing that makes the difference between life and death but maybe lowers downtime slightly for a bit after spending some time at the inn or logging out there.

     

    Otherwise, housing is just a nice thing that I'll probably use to store stuff in.

    • 2752 posts
    November 28, 2017 11:24 AM PST

    As it stands, I'd guess personal housing is not the direction they are thinking when it comes to housing/player buildings. The current/updated FAQ:

     

    "Housing isn’t currently a planned release feature. Doing housing properly is a big deal. We don’t want instanced housing or open world housing where urban sprawl takes up half the world and people can’t find a place to make their home. Post launch, we are looking at some ideas that affect gameplay such as Outposts that guilds could set up in areas appropriate to their level, and other players could visit their outpost. When they are done, kind of like the Wild West, you can pick up your wagon of stuff and move your Outpost. Again, this idea would be a post-launch feature."

     

     

    • 3016 posts
    November 28, 2017 11:56 AM PST

    Iksar said:

    As it stands, I'd guess personal housing is not the direction they are thinking when it comes to housing/player buildings. The current/updated FAQ:

     

    "Housing isn’t currently a planned release feature. Doing housing properly is a big deal. We don’t want instanced housing or open world housing where urban sprawl takes up half the world and people can’t find a place to make their home. Post launch, we are looking at some ideas that affect gameplay such as Outposts that guilds could set up in areas appropriate to their level, and other players could visit their outpost. When they are done, kind of like the Wild West, you can pick up your wagon of stuff and move your Outpost. Again, this idea would be a post-launch feature."

     

     

     

    What was the date of that posting and do you have a link?  :)  Thank you :)  Never mind..it was in the FAQ.    Thanks.


    This post was edited by CanadinaXegony at November 28, 2017 12:12 PM PST
    • 1785 posts
    November 28, 2017 11:57 AM PST

    So, I am moderately anti instancing. I want housing out in the world because I want to see player towns and cities. That said, I don't want super sprawl like what happened in UO and SWG. Vanguard had the right idea by having only certain areas with buildable plots. And I support instanced apartments as a first step into housing. Those full buildable plots should be something you aspire to and work towards, not something you get early on.

    As far as VR's plans, I like that they acknowledge that it needs to be done right. I am ok with waiting for an expansion (we waited for space flight in swg after all). But I don't know that I like the idea of temporary outposts or camps as the end-all housing solution. Practical? Sure. But it doesn't really bit the buttons that permanent player housing does. It's more of a convenience tool and less of a character goal, at least as it is described in the FAQ.

    We will have to see what comes :)

    • 3237 posts
    November 28, 2017 12:02 PM PST

    I loved the guild hall feature from Vanguard, but I wasn't really a big fan of how the plots of land worked.  There were basically a bunch of zones where people could purchase their lots and then build on them.  I think housing would be much more impactful if players could actually build stuff in the world, where they might run into other players.  Isolating player houses into "house zones" just felt pretty weak ... it was honestly less appealing than individual instanced housing that I remember from EQ2.

    I am really curious to learn more information about outposts.  There is a ton of potential when it comes to that feature but I also know that there will be plenty of concerns.  I think it would be great if players could set up shop outside of a dungeon, for example.  But I wouldn't want players to be able to bind there and come back whenever they wanted.  Maybe outposts can be something we can work on over time, but their placement is only ever temporary?  As far as "where" we can place them ... that's the most challenging question of all.

    If outposts can help facilitate player to player interaction via trading, selling, crafting, that would be fantastic.  But like others have mentioned, they should never offer enough convenience that players will automatically prefer going to an outpost over visiting a city.  I want to see them implemented in a way that promotes community and player to player interaction.  When guild halls were implemented in EQ2, the two major cities instantly became graveyards.  Thankfully, it's highly unlikely that we will see instanced housing ... but isn't a "zone full of houses" still pretty similar?

    • 3016 posts
    November 28, 2017 12:03 PM PST

    Nephele said:

    So, I am moderately anti instancing. I want housing out in the world because I want to see player towns and cities. That said, I don't want super sprawl like what happened in UO and SWG. Vanguard had the right idea by having only certain areas with buildable plots. And I support instanced apartments as a first step into housing. Those full buildable plots should be something you aspire to and work towards, not something you get early on.

    As far as VR's plans, I like that they acknowledge that it needs to be done right. I am ok with waiting for an expansion (we waited for space flight in swg after all). But I don't know that I like the idea of temporary outposts or camps as the end-all housing solution. Practical? Sure. But it doesn't really bit the buttons that permanent player housing does. It's more of a convenience tool and less of a character goal, at least as it is described in the FAQ.

    We will have to see what comes :)

     

    Yes if relegated to a housing section,  where players can't dump their homes all over the scenery..I'd agree with that.   But there is also Iksar's post above where VR doesn't seem to want to do open world or instanced housing,  but just outposts (mainly for guilds?)  If so, disappointing for those of us who DO enjoy housing.    Okay found where this was stated as per Iksar's post...in the FAQ.   Which means only guilds will have access to "housing" in my view.    Which means competition over crafting stations ...I suppose, and possible guild limits on who can use etc?  Hoping VR revisits this.

     

    Cana


    This post was edited by CanadinaXegony at November 28, 2017 12:16 PM PST