Forums » General Pantheon Discussion

Appearance Gear and Weapons

This topic has been closed.
    • 18 posts
    September 23, 2015 12:00 AM PDT

    Wasn't this question in the 'Pantheon Team - Questions for the Community!' survey? I believe it was. :-)

    I generally don't wan't the ability to change appearance on gear, but I do see the need for it some times. My problem is that I think that most endgame gear looks like crap compared to low level gear. And when everyone in the guild runs around in raid wearing the same bis gear with bright colours and pixie dust effects... then I wish I could make that über purple dagger look more like a regular dagger.

    • 12 posts
    September 23, 2015 8:36 AM PDT
    Celandor said:

    The fundamental problem with most MMORPGs is that everyone in a particular class tends to gravitate toward the same gear so you end up with a lot of clones running around in game.   The period where you really distinguish yourself by having a unique item is relatively short in relation to the time before you start seeing many mirrors of your character.

    Just don't give us a world where all the level 50 warriors look like identical extras from "Make Love, Not WarCraft".

     

    This is exactly what I see happening with no appearance system. Everyone is going to look cookie-cutter after being near endgame for awhile. It bugs me to no end when I have clashing gear styles.

    • 34 posts
    September 23, 2015 9:58 AM PDT

    I don't really have an issue with appearance gear. Its a fun aspect of the game for many and can lead to some great looks. On the other hand, top end gear should have unique graphics that can only be obtained by wearing the item in a primary slot. I like the system of having an appearance tab that can be toggled on and off, but I would limit the appearance slot to the item type of the primary slot, so if you are wearing a plate chest, you can wear another plate graphic, but not a leather, chain, or cloth, etc... It also adds another avenue for itemization. Not all end game item drops have to be BiS super awesome, etc... You could have some awesome appearance gear drop deep in dungeons or on raid mobs. Just to add variety to drop tables and slow down mudflation.

     

    With no appearance gear, people start looking all the same, which is boring to me.  Armor dyes are also important. And how about customizable crests that can be placed on cloaks, like in AA, to serve as guild tabards. I'd enjoy it if there was no guild tag displayed under the name, but they did have a crest on their cloak. Of course, thats heavily open to abuse because the instant you allow player generated crests is the instant you see Pedo-bear and creatively drawn genitals.

    • 793 posts
    September 23, 2015 11:05 AM PDT
    Bonadew said:

    Wasn't this question in the 'Pantheon Team - Questions for the Community!' survey? I believe it was. :-)

    I generally don't wan't the ability to change appearance on gear, but I do see the need for it some times. My problem is that I think that most endgame gear looks like crap compared to low level gear. And when everyone in the guild runs around in raid wearing the same bis gear with bright colours and pixie dust effects... then I wish I could make that über purple dagger look more like a regular dagger.

     

     

    And for that reason I would not be against, going to a craftsperson(NPC or PC), and having them remove the stats from a higher level item and attach them to a lower level item. So you could get the benefit of the better gear (maybe even minus a stat or 2) but maintain the look or you other gear.

    EQ Example:  I thought my Armor of Ro was much better looking than the Deepwater armor of better stats. Would have been nice to forge some of the stats from the DW and attach them to my Ro.

     

     

     

     

    • 8 posts
    September 25, 2015 7:14 AM PDT

    I want gear to look like it looks. I want people to know what I earned. I want to envy peoples gear as a motive to improve my own. 

     

    Arthur never painted excalibur and Dar never painted Ghoulsbane. 

    • 66 posts
    September 25, 2015 7:47 AM PDT

    For the most part, your armor and weapon graphics should reflect what you are actually wearing, imo. Being able to arbitrarily change the way your armor and weapons look is an immersion killer if you ask me. I remember being a noob in EQ, walking around seeing cool weapon graphics, and being like - "Whoa! Where did he get that? What is that??" /tell player123 Do you mind if I inspect? I'd like to see that sense of awe and wonder maintained, personally. Minimal aesthetic options I think are okay, however (Like choosing a sigil to display on a cloak or something). 

    • 85 posts
    September 26, 2015 12:57 AM PDT

    If I would choose I would skin all my gear that would make me look like a hobo. =)


    This post was edited by Azraell at September 26, 2015 8:36 AM PDT
    • 9115 posts
    September 26, 2015 8:37 AM PDT
    Azraell said:

    If I would choose I would skin all my gear that would make me look like a hobo. =)

    You are a hobo punk! lol ;)

    • 85 posts
    September 26, 2015 9:24 PM PDT
    Kilsin said:
    Azraell said:

    If I would choose I would skin all my gear that would make me look like a hobo. =)

    You are a hobo punk! lol ;)

     

     

    A hobo weilding dual epic focuses to blow things up with ease...

    But I did notice "fluff" items are turning into hot items for mmo's these days. I may start a forest fire with this but... Cash shop for " fluff" items only??? Another source of income for the game. When I mean "fluff" I mean fluff items ie costumes , pets , chests , house decor etc. Nothing more. Want a bad ass weapon?? Better grind X caverns for the staff of "Forgoten Hobos"... because the cash shop is for fluffness only.. 


    This post was edited by Azraell at September 26, 2015 9:37 PM PDT
    • 9115 posts
    September 26, 2015 9:41 PM PDT
    Azraell said:
    Kilsin said:
    Azraell said:

    If I would choose I would skin all my gear that would make me look like a hobo. =)

    You are a hobo punk! lol ;)

     

     

    A hobo weilding dual epic focuses to blow things up with ease...

    But I did notice "fluff" items are turning into hot items for mmo's these days. I may start a forest fire with this but... Cash shop for " fluff" items only??? Another source of income for the game. When I mean "fluff" I mean fluff items ie costumes , pets , chests , house decor etc. Nothing more. Want a bad ass weapon?? Better grind X caverns for the staff of "Forgoten Hobos"... because the cash shop is for fluffness only.. 

    Haha!

    Yes, this has come up previously a few times with very mixed results, some like it, some don;t and a few don;t care unless it changes gameplay advantages or breaks immersion. We as a team are very aware of this and will do what is best for Pantheon to make sure it succeeds and is around for a long time without jeopardising the playing experience :)

    • 578 posts
    September 26, 2015 10:06 PM PDT

    I believe items and gear that drop from mobs and bosses or are found from quest rewards should not be able to have their graphic altered. I don't mind appearance gear as long as it is gear you've earned. You have your equipped items and then you have slots for appearance items which can only be items you have looted or have been rewarded (basically how VG appearance gear). This way people can still recognize your feats but if you upgrade your item to a new item with a graphic you don't necessarily care for you can still keep your old image. And if appearance gear is able to be bought from a vendor it can not have the appearance of an item found from any mob or quest.

    With not allowing players to 'transmorgiphy' (whatever the hell the word is lol) their items to alter their appearance you keep recognition alive where players can only look like what they have achieved. This way when you look at someone who has gear from the hardest of bosses you know they at least earned it at some point. This also creates a nice time sink for players because if they want a certain look they have to go out and complete whatever task it is they need to do in order to receive that item.

    One area though that I wouldn't mind altering the appearance of items is with crafted items. The crafter can decide what image they want the item to have before its process is completed.

    • 105 posts
    September 27, 2015 4:59 AM PDT

    My thoughts:  I really don't feel the need to have appearance gear if the gear I acquire through my journeys doesn't look rather like a --forgive me for my crudenss-- puke.  I like armor that makes sense for my class, doesn't look like a troop of clowns outfitted me, and most importantly doesn't have stupid watermelon sized shoulders with 3 foot spikes standing up from them.  

     

    Also, I feel my appearance is mine.  That means I am against toggles whereby other people see me differently than I envision myself with the only exception being an ability to turn off cloaks for computers without the 'oomph' to handle it.  Dyes are all right to me as long as they're not garish colors.

     

    And lastly to address another point I've seen in this thread: I am dead-set against ANY type of cash shop what-so-ever.  Too many games have fallen into making the in-game earnings drab and dull in order to get people to empty their pockets buying the pretty things from the cash shop.  Lock boxes enrage me to the point of thinking about puppy skin boots and kitten fur gloves.  

    • 671 posts
    September 27, 2015 4:10 PM PDT
    Happytrees said:

    In my opinion, being able to have gear appear to be other gear is one of the worst features you could have in a MMO.

     

     

    This^

     

    If a player wants fluff, or an item to be changed, then there should be in-game mechanics and crafting that allows a player to give such items to crafters, and have them dyed or altered, etc. A guild has a Livery, then the guild crafters will be busy for months/years making the dies and colors and finding the mats to deck out their guild in like-colors, etc. As a sign of force & unity.

     

    It has to be player driven.. the mechanic itself (of changing armors) is not horrible, how it done is can be.

    • 1434 posts
    September 27, 2015 4:22 PM PDT

    I think at least dye should be considered. Nothing is worse than having like every color of the rainbow in a set of awesome armor. Altering gear further can be revisited down the line, but I personally don't want things like that to hold up development.

    • 671 posts
    September 27, 2015 4:30 PM PDT

    A grand master cobbler, or leather worker can deal with harder style dyes and colors, or adding adornments to armor, to make them look unique. This way, people with unique armor are unique, because they spent the time in game to seek out that look and used others to get it. It all stems from in-game activities and player processes.

     

    I do not care one bit, if such a mechanic holds Pantheon up for 5 months. You have to think about a healthy player driven economy & it's future.


    This post was edited by Hieromonk at September 27, 2015 4:30 PM PDT
    • 1434 posts
    September 27, 2015 7:39 PM PDT
    Hieromonk said:

    A grand master cobbler, or leather worker can deal with harder style dyes and colors, or adding adornments to armor, to make them look unique. This way, people with unique armor are unique, because they spent the time in game to seek out that look and used others to get it. It all stems from in-game activities and player processes.

     

    I do not care one bit, if such a mechanic holds Pantheon up for 5 months. You have to think about a healthy player driven economy & it's future.

    You can have a healthy player driven economy without those things. Nevertheless, they would be nice. I guess it all really depends on how well development goes from here and whether they have the financial backing to add features without pushing back the launch.

    • 671 posts
    September 27, 2015 8:29 PM PDT

    I do not think VR are worried about a launch window, rather than milestones. I may be wrong. But the point of Brad's phases  of alpha ~ beta is to have the foundational mechanics that the game will reside on, in game. Then any... and all expansion packs will sit ontop of that sub-set.

     

    Housing, boats & "out in the world" Guild Halls, all work under the base mechanics and crafting systems of the game.

     

    • 91 posts
    October 2, 2015 6:49 AM PDT

    I think gear should reflect the effort put into the game and if the game is centered around progression then the gear should reflect that.  I don't mind dye and I don't mind enchants that give off cool weapon effect but other then that the gear should say "check out what we accomlished"

     

    Xan

    • 9 posts
    October 3, 2015 9:40 PM PDT

    I wasn't a fan of it. Part of the magic in EQ was that a lot (not all) of the notable weapons/armor in the game had a look. Like: "There goes a monk with a robe of living fungus and their SoS/AC weapons." People would look at that and be like "nice gear" without even inspecting. Or ask "Is that a stave of shielding?"

     

    So not only do you remember the names. But can look at people as say: "He has a pair of lammy's". The whole appearance gear took that aspect away. You can have a guy wearing a wood sword and shield, but look like he's wearing a badass fllaming sword of awesomeness, and a uber shield of magic blocking. You get the idea. Kind of takes away the identity of the items.

     

    There could be minor status items. Perhaps a raid only dye. Or magical aura's surrounding your character (this can easily be linked to an item, though, further making it awesome). Making raid gear look like raid gear (something EQ kind of dropped the ball on until velious hit...even then, it wasn't that unique). But allowing someone change their appearance would be bad. If you have mismatched cruddy gear? Let it show. You'll appreciate looking at how awesome your character evolves outside of just a stat sheet.

    • 13 posts
    October 4, 2015 9:20 AM PDT

    Another import from FB...:

    No way, personalized glamourizin' any day! If I want to show off my 'epic lootz' that should be up to me; as more often than not I'll hate the look of the top end swag. ._. Some peeps speak of their concerns on throwing together ridiculous outfits when there's nothing more ridiculous than a block of solid ice enrobed in a rainbow halo, and that's passed off my 'epic' sword... I don't want that. I have a stance that's shared with having appearances limited to within the frame of the graphical presentation. I don't care for overly silly cosmetics.

    ...and as an addendum to that note: on a most basic level... I don't treat my avatar like some inanimate trophy mount; as such gear I feel should be more of a personal statement of expression - within reaonsable limits.  The inspect function is but one click away, if you really MUST know.  I showcase my 'worth' in action, not graphical statements.  Those are for me to enjoy.  Actually, in a game like FFXIV, the only time I find my eyes wandering to inspect someone is when they've put up a well orchestrated outfit and I want to know what pieces they've used to create the look~.

    • 232 posts
    October 7, 2015 6:59 AM PDT
    Linkamus said:

    For the most part, your armor and weapon graphics should reflect what you are actually wearing, imo. Being able to arbitrarily change the way your armor and weapons look is an immersion killer if you ask me. I remember being a noob in EQ, walking around seeing cool weapon graphics, and being like - "Whoa! Where did he get that? What is that??" /tell player123 Do you mind if I inspect? I'd like to see that sense of awe and wonder maintained, personally. Minimal aesthetic options I think are okay, however (Like choosing a sigil to display on a cloak or something). 

     

    This pretty much sums it up for me.  I hate the fact that "appearance items" have made their way into modern MMO's and have become the norm and expected.  I'm all for costumes, casual clothes, and other non-combat items. Let RPers RP.  I'll be seriously disappointed if our main tank shows up to raid the dragon wearing a dress with a jack-o-lantern head and candy cane swords.

    Reading this thread, its evident that preceived norms are so engrained in us that we talk as if its a feature that we should or shouldnt remove, rather than a feature we should or shouldnt add.  By this same mentality, I'm glad we're not discussing whether we should or shouldnt remove offline leveling as seen in EVE Online or if we should remove the ability to make one-button macro characters as seen in Rift, or whether we should or shouldnt remove the rockship mounts, Harley mounts and hoverboard mounts as seen in WoW.

    I think we all need to take a step back and ask ourselves what would be appropriate in THIS world with respect to the type of game they're making and the players they're targeting.

    • 21 posts
    October 7, 2015 11:40 AM PDT

    Personally I'm not a big fan of appearance gear. I think that drops/quest rewards should look the way they do. I do think that crafters should be able to at least change the color of the gear they can make, I think that would be cool and makes sense. The devs have said that there is going to be a lot of situational gear, so I think we'll all look different most of the time anyway.

     

    • 66 posts
    October 7, 2015 5:33 PM PDT
    Dekaden said:
     

      I'll be seriously disappointed if our main tank shows up to raid the dragon wearing a dress with a jack-o-lantern head and candy cane swords.

     

    This made me lol pretty hard. 

    • 41 posts
    October 7, 2015 6:29 PM PDT
    Kilsin said:

    Appearance gear and weapons - Do you like being able to change your characters appearance in-game or would you rather all players be known for their accomplishments by allowing everyone to see their earned armour and weapons, even if a few others have it too?

     

    http://on.fb.me/1FXb6sp

     

    We should be able to alter our appearance in-game.  Otherwise, people end up looking similar if not identical.  If people wish to "show off" items that came from significant accomplishments in-game, they can always leave the original armor/weapon as it is.  An in-game title could also suffice to show accomplishments instead of gear.

    • 383 posts
    October 8, 2015 11:48 AM PDT
    Happytrees said:

    In my opinion, being able to have gear appear to be other gear is one of the worst features you could have in a MMO.

    Would have to agree with this. It takes out the whole "awesome" factor when seeing someone run by with a cool looking weapon or armor piece. I'm also personally into armor styles that seem functional and not overdone. Meaning some games have armor sets that have spikes on them that are longer than their two handed great swords. I also don't care for plated armor for women being a bikini or mini skirt.