We have updated the Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen media page to include some great screenshots that have been taken and shared by our 24/7 testers. Check them out and let us know what you think!
Very nice! I notice you are making updates based on feedback and that is good! I can tell the skin is looking more painted and less vibrant/toyish. The character models too. In fact the second picture with the guy attacking the skeleton looks VERY NICE! I like the character model facial expression and colors on him. If you can go in THAT direction, that is a GOOD direction. Good job! I also noticed in your fourth picture with just the human male character model, you reduced the size of the eyes to be more in line with the concept art which is very good! Looks great! Skin brightness looks good too! There is something still off in his eyes in picture #4, kind of frozen looking, but definitely good direction! But I have to say I really really like picture #2 with the skeleton attack. Good animation, even though I know it is a still picture, you can tell it looks good and natural. Colors looking good and character model face is looking really good! Kudos, keep going in that direction and you got a winner with me at least!
Sorry just to edit I noticed past picture #10? it looks to have the old system. Just to let you know it might be confusing for some players. I just looked at picture #7 which gave me a good look at the character models. Again really like your direction, the skin looks less toyish. Face is looking good. It is starting to remind me more and more of original everquest but updated. Something about the eyes in picture #7 as noted before, something is kind of frozen looken about them but overall like the pose of the character on the ground too. Very cool and natural looking! Keep going in that direction, looks good!
Okay, I made a huge effort to not jump on the negativity bandwagon after the initial art style reveal video (although I did agree with most of what was being said) because the first two screenshots in that reveal video, I 'really' liked, and I hoped that over time, the rest would reflect that kind of atmosphere in the environment. The cartoon / infantile look towards the end, particularly the bear and the male model, I really wasn't a fan of. The reason being, Pantheon's system complexity, and an emphasis on respecting the environment, because it's dangerous (a key element missing from MMOs these days), simply does not match how cartoony those visuals were. It felt like playing chess, but with the pieces replaced by Pokemon Amiibos'.
In addition, over the past few years, I found myself gravitating less and less toward the world of Pantheon, there really wasn't anything I truly loved, but I'm so desperate to play an MMO that challenges me, that the gameplay was all that was keeping me interested. In short, the visuals needed a revamp, and a stylised art style is / was a wise move.
One of the Pantheon videos I remember most was 'The Making of a City', it amplified my desire to play the game immensely, but I’ve not felt that since then. However, the first screenshot on that media page gave me the same sense of wanting to be part of the world, I really like it. More atmospheric, less cartoony, more ‘serious’ without trying to mimic an ultra-realistic world.
Please keep refining the visuals in this direction, Pantheon needs to look like it takes the environment as seriously as it takes its gameplay mechanics, but you absolutely do not need a world that looks ‘real’ in order to do that.
Lastly, I assume this art style allows for more creative freedom, which is good, but please avoid the oversized armour and weapons, they are just so painful to look at. Stick thin character swinging a 6 foot sword like it’s made from paper is ridiculous.
You've made the sponges and the filling, you just need to decorate the cake now!
Yeah, this gave a better picture, i like the direction.
Seeing as its still in prealpha, if the direction going towards more "serious" as it seems to be, and less cartoony.
- This, for sure looks like an MMOrpg for me.
..Looking forward for more :)
dorotea said:Very much better than what we have seen since the change in direction. Perhaps less "realisitic" than some might like, but far less like a cartoon than many had feared based on the initial reveals.
I signed up for an Old-School MMO experience that refuses to hold your hand, and as a byproduct of that, much less emphasis is on the art for me. I know for a fact I'm not the only one who feels that way. With that being said, I actually like the new art style. Just wanted to share my support.
I knew from the beginning the art style had potential. Looking good, guys.
@VR, can we please get some new video to see it in action? Pretty please? Pretty please with a new art style on top?
I'd very much like to see some gameplay from those screenshots. Looks nice and dark and the skeletons look good and the fog is legit super cool.
Am I imagining things or do the trees actually look better too? My only real gripe after the reveal, was that I didn't like the trees and grass, I found them a little flat and not enough detail, but in these new screenshots they seem to look quite a bit better.
Ahh, I'm excited again. If I had any money I'd upgrade from champion so I could start doing prealpha testing too. Can't wait to see more!
The enviroment is perfectly fine. The models...look off. The human face...I'm not sure what it is but it's kind of scary. I can't figure out a way to express constructive critism while not offering insult. There is definitely improvement. That one screenshot with a moon at night in the style of the old graphics leaves me longing. But if we're to be moving foward in this new style of graphic, something about the faces needs some kind of tweaking. I honestly can't put my finger on it.
So, I showed these off to some friends to get a few more ideas because I could not pin down on why I dislike the new art so much.
I am NOT against stylized art at all. In fact I do enjoy it just as much as what Cyberpunk 2077 does.
What is it that bugs me then? Well, the best we could produce (and I don't take credit for that description, as it is not mine): Cartoon Art needs to have a distinct soul to be good. It is much harder to "get right" because it is harder to describe what is wrong if there is something wrong. As far as Pantheon art goes, it looks cheap. It does not look like it has a distinct style. Every model just looks like its own thing and they don't match up with each other. The polygon count may be too low to achieve that. Or it really is just cheap and quickly done on a weekend to "get something going".
Fundamentally, I am ok with cartoons in my games, if they have a soul, quality and they fit each other. The current Art has a long way to go, to get there. It looks like a cheap game from 2010, not an MMO that may be released anywhere between 2025 and 2030 (keep that in mind!). Sadly, it is hard to nail down what could be done in detail. They need more seriousness. Aimed less at the 8-12 year crowd and more towards the crowd that actually funded this.
As an example of Art that matches, has a sole and distinct style, think Darkest Dungeon, just lighter for the good races. A semi copy / pasta for those styles, and even get a narrator like those guys, ... the game would instantly get tremendously positive reviews. That style would also age well, I'd say.
To add something more productive as well here, my questions to the team would be simple and straight shooters:
As far as I am concerned, those answers would make me happy about the next producers letter. If missing all of these answers, I would consider it a colossal fail or PR stunt.
Rattenmann said:To add something more productive as well here, my questions to the team would be simple and straight shooters:
- You must have anticipated the backlash coming, when changing art to a child focused cartoon. Ignoring the mentioned gains this may bring: Is the backlash harsher, easier or exactly as expected?
- How many lost sales from the current audience due to the change, vs how many new sales from a new audience did you project?
- What is the projected timeline for release if nothing changes from now? How does it change if 247 meets expectations? How does it change, if 247 only meets half the projected gains?
- On a scale from 0 to 100: How feature complete is the current state of the game? On the same scale: How much of the TOTAL project time to you project to need to finish all features, without factoring in beta testing?
As far as I am concerned, those answers would make me happy about the next producers letter. If missing all of these answers, I would consider it a colossal fail or PR stunt.
As to question 3, if VR honestly tells everyone how long it will take to get this game to release and that number is many years (say >4) people will just walk away. Also, VR has never given definitive timelines whenever it was asked of them because they do not want to be held to any statements. For question 4, its an even more dangerous public relations disaster when, after 9 years 8 months that included a complete world rebuild/refactor, a massive art change, etc and they say its like 10% or 15%? That would cause people to walk away as well.
Unfortunately, you will never get an answer to those questions from VR, especially the last two.
Well. To be frank: The whole deal was build around TRUST. If they want to regain the lost trust, they need to be honest and open with the people that have been blindly given them money for over 10 years now. I know they won't do it. But they need to. ;-) if they don't people also walk away and more articles get written about it. Personally don't think ignoring the community any more would be less of a PR issue than just giving honest answers.
People are usually much more forgiving and understanding, if they feel like they are not being treated like a child. Having hope they try to get back that trust.
I must agree with Rattenmann regarding the lost trust. VR need to be open and honest with us, otherwise you just get a lot of people's backs up and lost trust in the project. Hiding this huge change behind a wall of silence and ignoring the backlash (until almost forced to respond), was, at best, unwise.
If VR had been open and honest about these plans from the outset, I guarantee there would be less upset and concern from us. I would still complain at the style change, I would still complain it was taking away development from Pantheon, but I would not be complaining about how VR have treated us, the customers. I would not be concerned with whether Pantheon was still viable. I would not be wondering if it is time to move on or not. And I still am wondering!
You might think spending time on this is taking time away from development, and you would be right. However, given the state of trust in VR at the moment, it would be time well spent to allieviate our concerns. Get us back on board by being open and honest and transparent. That is all I ask.