Forums » Off-Topic and Casual Chatter

Wow Classic isn't it

    • 107 posts
    September 6, 2019 7:03 AM PDT

    A lot of people seem to miss the old vanilla wow days but I'm not finding it all that different from the solo mmo game it has turned into for retail. I'm still stuck soloing to level though I do see other people playing around me which is nice. It's almost impossible to group with people because they are simply on different quests than me and even if they are on the same quests at least one of the quests is a collection quest that punishes you for grouping up as you have to split the tiger fangs or whatever with the other players. Even without grouping solo play is just easier and I am once again playing a game to level just so I can REALLY play the game at cap level.

    I hope Pantheon doesnt have a hundred quests in a zone because it kills leveling in a group. I hope we need to group up even at low levels or at least make it far more advatagious to group with other people to level up. I really want to start playing a game right when I start playing it, not just paying my leveling tax so I can play the end game. Is classic working well for anyone else?

    • 10 posts
    September 6, 2019 9:03 AM PDT

    yea i so agree thats why you have to start the content already with the mindset of community like pantheon is doing i dont care what blizzard think brining back wow classic was going to do the community is already tainted with the way we are use to questing and doing things in the game the way pantheon is doing is going to be so refreshing  you take a walk around the forest maybe explore some temple while killing a few monsters on your way just site seeing you notice another player and actly  stop your aka questing since its optinal and start to follow the path of the new player while shareing the loot you guys ern together if this was wow you would stay focus on your needs and questing so you dident fall behind pantheon giving us what we need to stop that bad habit and befriend others near our area

    • 500 posts
    September 6, 2019 12:01 PM PDT

    zendrel said:

    A lot of people seem to miss the old vanilla wow days but I'm not finding it all that different from the solo mmo game it has turned into for retail. I'm still stuck soloing to level though I do see other people playing around me which is nice. It's almost impossible to group with people because they are simply on different quests than me and even if they are on the same quests at least one of the quests is a collection quest that punishes you for grouping up as you have to split the tiger fangs or whatever with the other players. Even without grouping solo play is just easier and I am once again playing a game to level just so I can REALLY play the game at cap level.

    I hope Pantheon doesnt have a hundred quests in a zone because it kills leveling in a group. I hope we need to group up even at low levels or at least make it far more advatagious to group with other people to level up. I really want to start playing a game right when I start playing it, not just paying my leveling tax so I can play the end game. Is classic working well for anyone else?

    I tried WoW when it was released simply because many of my friends asked me to join them, but I just couldn't stick with it. The art style is just too cartoonish for my tastes, and the hand holding, even in vanilla, was very disappointing. I decided to give classic another try thinking that maybe I would feel different after all the intervening years, but it still evokes the same dislike I felt way back when.

    I really hate the idea of an endgame in an mmo...  Instead I prefer a long and engaging journey without any hand holding vs a mad rush to max level to begin enjoying the game world. 

    So to answer your question, no, Classic doesn't work for me at all.  Just my 2cp


    This post was edited by Grymmlocke at September 6, 2019 12:10 PM PDT
    • 1019 posts
    September 19, 2019 6:19 AM PDT

    I played for two weeks.  Almost.  Got to level 25 and I just wasn't feeling it.  The game was still over simplified for my liking.  I had 3 abilities on my hotbar I would wait to use in every fight.  There was no strategy and I knew before even attempting to fight a mob if I'd win or lose regardless of what I did.

    • 1247 posts
    September 23, 2019 1:41 PM PDT

    Vanilla WoW was and will always be nothing more than a joke.


    This post was edited by Syrif at September 25, 2019 5:23 AM PDT
    • 27 posts
    September 30, 2019 7:11 AM PDT

    I dont wish to join the cool kids and shoot down WoW C. That got old when EQ was out. Is it EQ ...nope. Not even close.But it doesnt have quest markers on the map. Theres no chopper motorcycles. Theres no carnie atmosphere. Theres no golden  wisp guiding you everywhere. You have to read to know and understand what your doing.....and I do...and I immerse myself in what I got...which is more than what this community has as a whole to begin with. I group all the time. Sometimes its not for my quests, but thats ok. Its still a community and its fun to meet others and group....which i do alot. The population centers on my server are booming and theres a lot of social interaction...good and bad. Fun is there to be had....if you want it. Is it challenging...? Depends....sometimes yes and sometimes no. I am level 38 now. A gnome Mage. I never played WoW before so I take my time and read the quests and read the lore in the castles. I explore. SO long story short....you can complain about  what it isnt and look forward to more newsletters containing more concept art and call it progress, or immerse yourself a little bit and meet some like minded people and loosen that tight sphincter a little bit. Have a good one . 

    • 66 posts
    September 30, 2019 11:18 PM PDT

    WoW did a number of things right around release that created the opportunity for re-release. The lore folks did a standup job at points (despite roughly compelling players away from reading quest text with listed objectives). The zone artists did a handy job, and zone flow is relatively tight and engaging. I concur about the art style just not being for me, despite logging multiple years worth of hours in-game. That doesn't mean other people won't love the art style, or that there isn't a little to love for everyone (I still miss my adorable turtle mounts - yes, plural). Same could be said about the level of difficulty. There's not a whole lot of strategy involved, as Kittik mentioned. That's been a gripe about the game since before it ever launched, especially when comparing it to its predecessors. But some people dig the casual glide. Others dislike it only at certain times, from a certain distance, or anything in between. I can safely say that very few NPCs fought during the leveling process have mechanics worth noting. Barring a minority of named quest/dungeon/group mobs, WoW Classic leveling mostly consists of class/level checks. That's not surprising for most modern gamers, probably, but WoW certainly contributed to lowering that bar. Being a soloer in most games - even the ones not designed for it - I must say WoW kind of took the de-emphasis of grouping to an extreme. Hopefully the Classic populations aren't as bad at excluding certain classes from groups. Back when I played around launch, the game was basically fighting class bugs and glaring class-balance differentials (not to be confused with specialties) while killing ten rats.  I'm sure the class bugs and server instability issues have been fixed in the intervening years (not currently able to play Classic, so can't say firsthand). Hopefully arcane missiles actually land now. I'm also certain the quest grind is roughly the same, maybe with some exp modifiers tweaked. Again, great for some, less for others. The game is psychologically more fulfilling than just grinding, for sure, but the reward system doesn't hold a candle to its forebears (for me). Getting a new piece of amazing dungeon loot that was going to be replaced the next day was underwhelming for the most part. It also often made searching for groups less than worthwhile.

    WoW Classic servers seem primarily like a way to capitailze on nostalgia. They're not the first or only older, popular game rolling out classic servers. There's certainly a related nostalic attraction for many Fantheons, as has come up on these forums repeatedly. I'd be on a relaunch of Vanguard (as rocky as original launch was) in seconds. Most gamers who were around for the mid-2000s have played WoW Classic before though, and it's really only the design changes from Cataclysm and population-level considerations that necessitate a re-release of old content. For some, there's a draw to return to haunts that may be a bit rose-tinted with the distance of intervening years. And to those who never got a chance to play something they may have heard a lot about, the Classic servers offer an enticing opportunity. There's also plenty of middle ground.

    WoW around launch was not a bad game, despite some glaring flaws. Would I play Classic? Sure - maybe. Might take it for a spin if my girlfriend had a working computer. We met during WotLK, and she never got a chance to really play the earlier builds. But as with all games us gamers invest our time and money in, it's a personal choice.

    These next bits may wander lightly off-topic, but I feel a bit compelled to mention (without singling anyone out in respect for forum rules - and acknowledging the already obscene length of this sentence, given the amount of clauses, like that one, and that one too) that periods are a thing in most written languages. They also may drastically aid effective communication.

    Secondly, projecting the tautness of certain organs may say more about the commenter than they realize, as does poorly-veiled passive aggression (<- case in point on the latter). Enjoy whatever you enjoy. Maybe I'll even see you there and get the chance to enjoy it with you. Maybe you'll grief the creeping crud out of me. They're wide worlds we walk.


    This post was edited by DagNabbit at October 1, 2019 11:59 AM PDT
    • 945 posts
    October 1, 2019 5:28 PM PDT

    Simply because PRotF is a "group-centric" game, don't believe that you will always have a group.  You will absolutely need to be able to play solo the same way you did in WoW while leveling.  If VR makes quest content too isolating or too communicable then people will complain.  i.e. People are going to complain either way, so it would be my guess that they will lean toward the complaints that will yield them a higher player base (which leans toward solo content).  If the quests objectives are too easily shared, some people will circumvent a lot of content by purchasing quest objectives from people selling them (similar to MQ transactions in EQ).

    I'd bet money there will be more solo content than most are expecting.

    • 66 posts
    October 1, 2019 7:22 PM PDT

    I'm sure you're right, Darch, except maybe "the same way you did in WoW." When Vanguard was in development, they also touted groups as being prioritized. I recall that around launch, you had about 200 feet from your home city's door before things started getting rough (at least the DE city... which I also recall having one of the steepest curves, highest level bordering areas, treacherous paths to travel, and progression-breaking bugs...). Much of the group focus got watered down after release when the populations weren't there to sustain as much group play as intended in such a MASSIVE world. There were still a bajillion dungeons and overworld areas intended for everything from two players to a full group. Some dungeons were even soloable if careful, the right class, or properly geared/prepared. I think some of the devs working on Pantheon probably recall those issues, as well as what worked in its predecessors (EQ, Vanguard, WoW even) and many of the more modern games they've worked on. I know the devs have stated they realize not everyone who wants to play Pantheon is going to have perhaps as much time as yesteryear, and that they were trying to strike a balance with folks' real life demands, difficulty, and fair progress/activity per session. I'd maybe guess that a lot of over-world content will be soloable or meant for smaller groups (2-3) - sort of where people will be hanging out while they're forming a dungeon group, picking up relevant quests through exploration/perception, etc. Backing that up is the FAQ, which responds directly to the question of solo content:

    "1.4 Will you be able to solo in Pantheon?

    Yes. While most content will be designed for groups, there will typically also be content that is soloable. Some classes may solo better than other classes."

    Edit: Personally, I love pushing the bounds of what can be soloed with any given class. If someone tells me content takes a whole group, and I can't find one, I'll darn well find a way to have some fun or at least explore and familiarize myself with an area for when I do eventually find that group. I spent probably literal years running around invis or stealthed in nearly every game where it's available, and I've come across many groups needing replacements/corpse help, did a woosh-by buffing, or saved some folks' bacon when I saw them struggling. Despite enjoyinging solo play, I love a PC populated world. People are what make MMOs truly interesting and my favorite game genre (as well as the groaniest at times).

    2nd edit... I was that absurd rogue in Vanguard who had 9001 flechettes in my inventory from over-pickpocketing materials while solo. I kited bosses for multiple minutes while my group ran back or AoE kited when I accidentally pulled like 12 adds. Totally not supposed to be in the rogue wheelhouse at almost negative AoE DPS or with 1s snares... but while in Rome when it's on fire... I love me some utility and tools that can be used creatively in a pinch. I recall getting the, "I didn't know a rogue could do that," constantly, even in the highest level areas. I miss my little ginger halfling. *sigh*


    This post was edited by DagNabbit at October 1, 2019 7:50 PM PDT
    • 41 posts
    January 15, 2020 2:49 AM PST
    i love vanilla wow.
    im at 45 days played right now and it came out end of august.
    its still overall the best game ive ever played even if its far from perfect. you are known on your server and you know the other ppl on your server. i collected lots of contacts while playing and had lots of conversations.
    but its still too much handholding for my taste for example. travelling still too fast. overall not punishing enough. etc etc
    and the biggest thing i hate about wow are addons/mods. im 100% sure it would be a way better game with a way better community if they just would ban addons.
    everyone is rushing through the game with questhelpers... >:(
    • 1273 posts
    January 15, 2020 8:57 AM PST

    One big difference between wow and eq (both classic) is that in EQ you needed to group to kill equal level mobs efficiently.  You could kill lower level mobs and gain little experience and have less downtime, but to really gain experience you needed to group and kill tougher things.  In WoW you can gain pretty much max exp soloing even level mobs with almost no downtime.

    I personally prefer the "being forced to group" model, that's the main difference in my opinion.  In WoW you can make it all the way to max level without ever really getting to know anyone.  

    • 1281 posts
    January 18, 2020 6:45 PM PST

    zendrel said:

    A lot of people seem to miss the old vanilla wow days but I'm not finding it all that different from the solo mmo game it has turned into for retail. I'm still stuck soloing to level though I do see other people playing around me which is nice. It's almost impossible to group with people because they are simply on different quests than me and even if they are on the same quests at least one of the quests is a collection quest that punishes you for grouping up as you have to split the tiger fangs or whatever with the other players. Even without grouping solo play is just easier and I am once again playing a game to level just so I can REALLY play the game at cap level.

    I hope Pantheon doesnt have a hundred quests in a zone because it kills leveling in a group. I hope we need to group up even at low levels or at least make it far more advatagious to group with other people to level up. I really want to start playing a game right when I start playing it, not just paying my leveling tax so I can play the end game. Is classic working well for anyone else?

    I've never been a raider, but I always had as much fun with low level characters as I do max. So I disagree completely that the game 'starts' at the cap. But I also like having alt characters so starting at level 1 is fine with me.