Forums » Pantheon Classes

Classes and Armor Types

    • 11 posts
    August 2, 2019 11:40 AM PDT

    I have always wandered why there are certain armor types that were used in our History as a species. That hardly ever gets used in MMO Fantasy based games. I started my Love of MMO's with EQ, Then EQ2, Aion, DAOC, ESO, and Life is Feudal. And I am really looking foward to Pantheon. With that being said it would be nice to customize your charcter through gear choice and specialization. I am going to Use the Warrior class as an example for my post because this would be more for that class than anyother. With the Warrior class being able to yield any weapon, and any armor type. In regards to tradition your tanks are always plate user's , Clerics and other healer clases, Chain, and or cloth, sometimes plate for the most part, Ranger and Rougues are 9 out of 10 times leather. and mages classes are allways cloth.I would like to advocate for a Class in Pantheon that would Use Scale Armor.    

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                     Take the Bard or Dirge class from EQ2 for example instead of them wearing Chain or Leather. They are considered for the most part through out MMO's to be a utility class why not give them their own armor type Say Scale Armor( Historically was not as good as plate for protection but on par and better than chain in certain areas ) what it did allow was for decent protection with better manuverability. Now back to my topic of Warrior Class. I think the broad spectrum of this class should allow for more Specialization  to the player IE expertise in ceartian weapons/Shields/Armors that would fit your play style as a tank or a Utility player(2handed DPS). What I am getting at is say I beccome an expert in Plate(High damage mitigation, Low Mobility) and choose to be an expert in Tower shield style of shields(High damage mitigation, low mobility) that this should affect my base skills in a certain way, my auto attack speed, skills like riposte and other possible skill sets. Now add my choice of 1 handed weapons, Say I go with a 1 handed Axe over a Sword or Hammer, in most MMO's an Axe typically cause some sort of small DOT(bleed) damage. Swords typically offer better overall damge with nothing else. Now factor in the 1 handed sword has better range than a 1handed axe. That would affect how close I as a tank will need to be for my skills to work and also affect the distance i need to move to avoid AOE damage form a boss as an example. Now add my armor and shield choice we discussed previously I am considerably slower so it takes longer for me to roll out or run out of those ranges. and these choices  should also affect my skill sets, The Armor/Shield/Weapon type make Some skill stronger and others weaker based on my choices. You dont have to change the skill tree at all what this does if gives a bonus or debuff  to those skill sets based on your choice. But not to the point that you can not Tank. But how you Tank how your group has to play with your style. So with what I am thinking depending on your class, what available armor/weapon/shield(if your class uses one) you chose for that class affects you and how you play differently than the next player that plays your class. To me this would add alot of content to the game in crafting, rare drops and group and raid make up. and allows  mobs/dungeons/raid zones to be completed using different tactics based on who is in your group or raid.

      Let me know what you all think, and debate or elabroate with me on this thank you.

     


    This post was edited by Seton at August 2, 2019 11:43 AM PDT
    • 40 posts
    August 3, 2019 6:08 PM PDT

    If scale armor is good enough for Captain America, it's good enough for me :)

     

    But seriously I would indeed like to see scale, splint and ring armor in the game, the more choices the better!


    This post was edited by Nagasakee at August 3, 2019 6:09 PM PDT
    • 2353 posts
    August 5, 2019 10:53 AM PDT

    Just as a note, scale was actually worse general protection than mail and offered poorer mobility due to weight. 

    • 1500 posts
    August 5, 2019 3:00 PM PDT

    Gambeson was actually a very good armor, far better than hardened leather.  Scale and Ring armors were rare as they offered very little additional protection from just good quality leather armor.  Why would you want to throw in additional sets of terrible armor knowing that you'll just be replacing it in very short order?  Unless of course you want it designed such that scale, split and ring actually have a useful lifespan such that we would not see player wearing plate armor till near the level cap.  Only then would I say to expand the armor availability.  Personally though I'd rather the dev spend time on more important (i.e. things that have a much longer lasting lifespan and benefit the game to a much greater degree) than just more armor sets that barely differentiate from each other.

    • 11 posts
    August 5, 2019 5:43 PM PDT

    I just used scale as an example. what I am getting at is that armor it self should offer certain traits , better speed , defense, more magicka, or stam, or regens etc that affect your skills in game(does not include enchants or gem sockets or whatever system they use for crafting)and nothing ground breaking just a small tweak. as well as your weapon choice, and shield choice if your class uses them. so that you can tweak your Toon in game. I would rather see something along that line than sub-classes. is my basic thought behind the post. ive played to many games were an item looks like a buckler shield , but offers better tanking stats than a shield that looks like a tower shield Etcc, same with armor and weapons, just looking for armor, shields and weapons to add a little more flavor to the game. a 1 handed axe should not have the same range as a 1 handed sword , unless it is a short sword, those kinda of things.

     

             Say I go with a 1 handed Axe over a Sword or Hammer, in most MMO's an Axe typically cause some sort of small DOT(bleed) damage. Swords typically offer better overall damge with nothing else. Now factor in the 1 handed sword has better range than a 1handed axe. That would affect how close I as a tank will need to be for my skills to work and also affect the distance i need to move to avoid AOE damage form a boss as an example. Now add my armor and shield choice we discussed previously I am considerably slower so it takes longer for me to roll out or run out of those ranges. and these choices should also affect my skill sets, The Armor/Shield/Weapon type make Some skill stronger and others weaker based on my choices. 

    Quoteing myslef there but that is the bottom line i would like to see in a MMO , i think it would add alot to the game. And that would allow certian classes to have stronger spells, or attacks etc based on what armor/weapons/shield they choose that is avaialable to their class. So a cleric that wears cloth armor may have more magicka than one that wear plate or chain etc, as well as some heals or other skills being either stronger or weaker based on your armor/weapon/shield choice so their is variances in how someone may play their cleric. Ie heals would be stronger, but maybe your group buff is weaker with your choice. all dependant on your choice of gear and equipment available to your class. And yes i would like to see other armors have their place or usefullness based on how you decide to spealize your Toon within your class.


    This post was edited by Seton at August 5, 2019 5:55 PM PDT
    • 8 posts
    August 6, 2019 5:19 PM PDT

    They should just let any class to use whatever armor they want and keep the bonuses to benefit specific classes.. that way they can All/All everything and not have to think about it. Then if i want my wizard to run around in plate with no mana pool so be it. 

    • 1560 posts
    August 6, 2019 8:46 PM PDT

    Jahosphat said:

    They should just let any class to use whatever armor they want and keep the bonuses to benefit specific classes.. that way they can All/All everything and not have to think about it. Then if i want my wizard to run around in plate with no mana pool so be it. 

     

    Seems like the best way to break the game with specific skills and spells added for utility, than end up making a wizard tanking.

     

    About the OP :

     

    The more you add class specific items, the less gear you make avaliable for the whole classbase. Sharing armor is important, because it doesn't make a single piece worth only for a class, and it doesn't waste design for a thenth of the playerbase each time you make an item. Of course some things might be "class" designed, healers armors as an example seems like they will not fit any other class (Plate/mail/leather with caster stats), but not pidgeonholing players into wearing only their "BIS" stats is important to avoid powercreep at all cost. A +STR/+WIS chainmail might be good for a handfull class if the game is not flowed with "STR/DEX"  or "INT/WIS" chestmails.


    This post was edited by MauvaisOeil at August 6, 2019 8:50 PM PDT
    • 11 posts
    August 7, 2019 1:20 PM PDT

    Interesting concept a wizard with no mana pool, I agree with the class items make less gear for the class base.  take Jahosphats wizard with no mana pool in plate example: basically he would be considered a battle mage, in plate, or chain and not a pure caster. In my line of thinking plate armor wont give him the best mana pool etcc, but it may increase the strength of certain types say his/her support spells, of the spells that are allready available in the base class, at same time making other spells weaker, ei Dps and or aoe spells. along with his physical damage mitigation due to being in plate, but it lowers his magic resist as well.just saying there are alot of diferent ways of taking the base classes  that exist and having different paths for them that add variety to the game play, group setups, basically altering the base class depending on his/her play style.


    This post was edited by Seton at August 7, 2019 1:23 PM PDT
    • 594 posts
    August 7, 2019 4:58 PM PDT

    Jahosphat said:

    They should just let any class to use whatever armor they want and keep the bonuses to benefit specific classes.. that way they can All/All everything and not have to think about it. Then if i want my wizard to run around in plate with no mana pool so be it. 

    I like this idea Jahosphat.  Similar to DnD, you can pick up and wear anything, but if you aren't proficient with it you will not be able to use it effectively in combat (but you could wear/wield it for roleplaying).  It sounds like this concept will work one way but not the other in PRotF... what I mean by this is the warrior paladin and cleric (and likely bard) are listed as being able to wear all armor types (although there will likely be class specific gear as well).  With that said, the tanks likely won't be "tanking" in cloth, although they can wear it for looks or perhaps for some other special effect the equipment would provide (like maybe a robe that allows levitation for example), as well as maybe a piece of chain or leather may give more avoidance or increase DPS somehow compared to a piece of plate.  I think it would be fair if other classes could wear different armor types if perhaps they found a piece of armor that could cast some useful ability.  No matter what armor a class wears, we know that it won't make a difference in a non-tank class' tanking ability because there is going to also be an armor proficiency skill (otherwise a cleric and bard could have the same defenses as a paladin or warrior).

    Add:  But that's not going to happen :)  
    They can't even let the DL wear plate :(


    This post was edited by Darch at August 7, 2019 5:16 PM PDT
    • 1500 posts
    August 9, 2019 10:25 AM PDT

    Jahosphat said:

    They should just let any class to use whatever armor they want and keep the bonuses to benefit specific classes.. that way they can All/All everything and not have to think about it. Then if i want my wizard to run around in plate with no mana pool so be it. 

    But would you be truly happy and content with that, when faced with groups that would reject your manaless, and useless, Wizard?  No, you wouldn't be happy and you would run to the forums and complain to VR that you decision to deliberately gimp your character because of your desire to wear plate, should instead not have penalties for doing so.

    As VR isn't stupid, they will keep the armor differences between the races/classes as that provides good balance.

    • 21 posts
    August 9, 2019 5:02 PM PDT

    The only reason to add multiple forms of armor is for the bonuses and the negatives as seen in other games. Most games use plate as a heavy item restricting movement and little to no magical stats while cloth on opposite of the spectrum with higher magical stats and not impeeding speed. The only way I would want a open armor style game is if it were a benfit in some sort of way to wearing it and negative that I have to think about, but even in this as a caster I wouldn't wear plate because the negative is too high and the benefit...well really wouldn't benefit me. Now leather and scale might have some options as long as these "hybrid" armors would have something added that might make me want to take a chance on them. 

    • 8 posts
    August 10, 2019 9:27 AM PDT

    The market will dictate what a gimped mage is running around with plate. As in end game (unless for fun) you wouldn't see a wiz running around in plate. Especially for raids etc. In eqemu I made everything all/all for that reason.. never saw anyone using something that gimped them unless it was for fun.. and it freed up time for selecting stats and other stuffs..


    This post was edited by Jahosphat at August 10, 2019 9:31 AM PDT