April arrives awash in announcements and alliteration. Under Wraps gets things going with a look at some of our emergent gameplay and information on an upcoming stream with our friend CohhCarnage. The fearsome North Tusk Orcs come to life in an interview with Justin Gerhart, Forrest Imel, and Will Barry. Next up, we shed some light on our Pledge Rewards and how they will be handled going forward. We have an insightful Q&A with one of the newest members of our Development team, Environmental Artist Ross Worthley. And putting the bow on the whole thing is our favorite segment, our Community Spotlight, introducing a crafting fanatic who goes by the surname of DracoKalen.
http://www.pantheonmmo.com/newsletter/2019_april_intro/
Great information, thanks for sharing this month.
I know the original plan was to have badges displayed next to character names. I'd rather the badges be on the inspect screen. I like having the character names just plain without anything else. At the very least allow us to turn off graphics so that only names are displayed.
I do have to admit I don't care about the newsletters anymore, I completely trust VR to make a great game. I feel like the newsletters might be spoiling too much. I'm going to know about 90% of the game before playing!!!
With that said, a nice trade off would be a rough estimated timeline!! I know y'all don't want to disappoint us but I seem to be disappointed every month without some indication of how far into development we are or disappointing myself when my own expectations arent met. From my perspective the newsletters seem to indicate 1 step forward and 2 steps back (but I don't know how to judge development). I might be in the minority, who knows.
Not trying to complain, but advocating for some sort of gauge, rough rough timeline or percent complete, I dunno.
Honestly, I do appreciate that y'all give us any information at all. Really enjoy the streams and your dedication, creativity and hard work is obvious. Absolutely cannot wait!!
I don't know why some of you complain about the newsletter. Don't read it if you never enjoy it. However, every single time a newsletter comes out, they do give us a bit MORE information each time. Just because it's not information "you" specifically want to hear, doesn't mean it's not significant information.
Here are some things for you to remember:
1). They are working on a game which takes several years to create/design - this can be extended a tad if they develop new ideas to add to the game or if there ever may be a big error/bug they need to fix.
2). They are developing a much better player forums/website for us to use (hopefully one with a better search function). This also takes time... Especially since it's not like a small guild forum, but rather for a large population of people.
3). They are trying to complete one large main area (Project Faerthale), which I can only hope and assume is for Alpha. Something for us Pre-Alpha and Alpha players to get a full experience from. "This is how the other starting zones will feel once the game is complete" sort of thing.
4). You pledged, because you believed the VR team was going to provide you a wonderfully immersive game, the next best MMO, even with what little they had from the start up until this point. They made no promises of a specific Alpha date or release date at any point.
Information you may have missed: There's a stream on the 25th. It might not showcase new zones, but its a stream they are putting together to allow us to ask questions and see their progress in other aspects other than the zones they are so busy working on for us fans. They are working on the Orcs now, which look awesome. We've seen some wraiths and ratkin, we've seen Halfling, Elven, and Human structural designs, and now we see some Orcs! They added another person to their team! This is great news because it means they can afford to do so and more creative hands and minds working on Pantheon; which is always a wonderful addition.
Just please refrain from being so pessimistic, we are all patiently waiting. If you're wondering where specific information is, just ask. You'll probably get a more forward answer from someone than from the newsletter that you were hoping would just provide for you.
That's well put, Fancy. I don't like to reply to a reply but you made a good one. Side note: I'm pledged to four mmos in development at this time (SC, COE, AOC and Pantheon) and this one is looking the most promising. Which I did not expect given the resources and recent history of VR. Things are looking better than I imagined for a company this size.
It is almost unprecedented how open and transparent VR has been with development, and it is really quite sad people are not able to keep things in perspective and expect the game to be done in six months. I am confident that VR will make the game I have been waiting for, close to 15 years now, if that means waiting another few years, it will be worth it.
antonius said:Keep things in perspective? This thing has been in development for over 5 years already and there is not even a reasonable estimate other than at least another year and half (and probably more). Sorry, but most people do not want to "wait another few years". Following a game for a decade is just not realistic, even for what we hope is going to be the best MMO since EQ (let us hope).
Yeah. Here is some perspective for you.
The original Kickstarter failed, so it is unlikely the game has been in constant development for the last 5 years. More realistically, it has only been in constant development since late 2016 when they switched to the current pledge model, 2.5 years. World of WarCraft took 5 years to develop. Elder Scrolls Online took 7 years to develop. Both of those games already had established lore and game worlds to build on, and both games came from big name developers with near unlimited resources to throw at them. So, even if we take your (flawed) estimate of development time, and add another two years, that still leaves Pantheon at 7 years in development, which is entirely reasonable for an MMO to go from practically nothing to full fledged release from an indie studio on a shoestring budget. If you are so impatient you cannot handle a reasonable development time of 7 years, there are any number of great and fun games out today you can occupy your time with.
Or maybe read this poignant article: https://massivelyop.com/2019/01/31/massively-overthinking-the-boring-mmo-development-between-bookends-of-hype/
@antonius If there is an actual lack of progress or they failed to release Newsletters on their scheduled timeframe more than a couple times, then yes, I can see why some people would have a reason to voice their concerns on the matter. A good example would be Star Citizen. That's been in development for forever now, and they keep adding more "content" to the game when the game hasn't even been released yet. There are some games where you hear next to nothing from the developers for a period of time. VR is actively supplying us Newsletters with interviews, new information from the game, screenshots and visuals of what they are progressing on.
Like I stated, you can actually SEE in previous Newsletters what they are working on. It's not just a couple paragraphs telling you they are working on this and that; they are showing you. Just because you don't like that it's not being completed as fast as you'd like, doesn't make it insignificant progress.
Also, I'd like to point out that I never once stated you have to only say happy things or keep your mouth shut. I simply asked people to refrain from being as pessimistic as you are. You're more than welcome to question Visionary Realms and the game itself. In fact, I encouraged you to ask questions. But, every single newsletter that comes out, we get the "where's the substance from these newsletters" types of people coming out to complain, but never to ask valid questions. "When will we see milestones or a progress timeline?", "Can we expect to see one in the near future?", "Other than doing another Dungeon, what else will be happening with the stream on the 25th", etc.. These are questions that will answer some of your concerns without getting direct answers you know you won't get from questions like "When's Alpha?". Actually, some of these questions I hope will eventually be answered soon, but I won't be throwing a fit over it.
And eunichron is right, even if they have technically been working on it for the past 5 years - they didn't complete their "Series A" funding until 2017. They started off with a small passionate group of people that wanted to create the type of game that Pantheon will be and it has since expanded and received more funding. I knew about the game back in 2015, but I didn't pledge right away because I needed to see more before I felt comfortable and had enough faith in the team. Once I saw their progress and passion, I jumped on the bandwagon. These things take time and people have to learn this the hard way with how game development is today. People buy into Alpha and expect to be playing a fully developed game right away and this is never the case (unless its a steam game, but then its in the Alpha phase for the next 10 years).
Antonius said : Got it. Say great happy things or keep your mouth shut. People have every right to question the substance of updates or the progress they have seen. Tons of people are dying for this and for it to be a success (myself included) but not everyone is willing or should be willing to just blindly accept everything the developers say and do. Where some see transparency and accept whatever is said, others see a lack of measureable progress and are concerned. I mean, this game actually ever getting released is far from a fait accompli, despite what some think.
Honestly I don't know where you got that "right to" idea. That's not a public space, there is no rights over thoses that are on the forum guideline. This crazyness of "I think I paid for a product and am an investor so my criticism is right" should really stop, it's pledging, if you feel spoiled for your money (if you donated anything significant) then I'm sorry, you didn't read the ToS or the fact you pledged money (IE : made a donation) and have no rights in the final product.
You're angry ? Great, now go on with it.
MauvaisOeil said:Antonius said : Got it. Say great happy things or keep your mouth shut. People have every right to question the substance of updates or the progress they have seen. Tons of people are dying for this and for it to be a success (myself included) but not everyone is willing or should be willing to just blindly accept everything the developers say and do. Where some see transparency and accept whatever is said, others see a lack of measureable progress and are concerned. I mean, this game actually ever getting released is far from a fait accompli, despite what some think.
Honestly I don't know where you got that "right to" idea. That's not a public space, there is no rights over thoses that are on the forum guideline. This crazyness of "I think I paid for a product and am an investor so my criticism is right" should really stop, it's pledging, if you feel spoiled for your money (if you donated anything significant) then I'm sorry, you didn't read the ToS or the fact you pledged money (IE : made a donation) and have no rights in the final product.
You're angry ? Great, now go on with it.
Yeah that literally had absolutely nothing to do with what I said. Completely off the mark. I said literally zero about donating or contributing or being an investor etc. Please try and read things before attacking in the future. I am not here to fight or attack anyone so I will simply say that all people who follow a game as fans have a right to express their views and opinions, because at the end of the day, without them the entire industry would collapse. The fans are what keep this and many other similar type industries going. To expect them to just wait around forever or digest the same news in different packages forever is foolhardy and ultimately does not serve anyone.
I simply think that telling people to go away basically if they are not going to be blindly optimistic is a position no one is entitled to have. Everyone is entitled to their thoughts and to express them regardless of what they paid etc. I don't care about the money or donations or any of that nonsense that was attributed to me. I am DYING for this game to be released and to be everything us EQ cast offs pray that it will be. However, an attitude of positivity only will not help anyone...the fans or VR. Frankly, the two posters who expressed criticism at the pace of some things and their views on it were perfectly entitled to do so, and in my opinion also pretty accurate.
Furthermore, if we are going to discuss the notion of what financial contributors are entitled to, I find the idea that someone who donates has no right to voice their thoughts ludicrous. Someone who has given 50+ dollars for example, has already per the terms, PURCHASED the game. Basically a pre order in effect, and I cannot fathom arguing that someone who buys a game has no right or place to voice their thoughts on a forum to the developers. No one would seriously argue that the purchaser of an item cannot express their views on it. Just because the game is not finished does not change anything. I do not see anyone demanding profit sharing or a percentage of the company etc, but people who presumably already paid for a copy of the game (and likely more...maybe even much more) have every right and frankly, the place to express their feelings about the process.
Nobody here "donated" anything. This is not the Red Cross or the ASPCA (in fact, go donate some money to your local ASPCA while you are at it!). They gave money in exchange for something. The crowdfunding argument about donating etc is idiotic. Nobody donates anything, period. They give money in advance for something in exchange, regardless of the increased risks that said product will not come to fruition, it is still an exchange. Lastly, regarding your attacks on me, I am sorry but to me it appears that you are the angry one as you felt the need to lash out and attack me and call me spoiled etc, all based on absolutely nothing I said.
Of course anyone is entitled to blowing their own hot air and airing opinions, though the value is pretty subjective. VR will do whatever they want and develop this game at whatever pace they can regardless of whatever cries some in the community might have, so I'd say it's somewhat pointless (if not harmful to the overall community) to gripe about. The gaming industry seemed to thrive just fine in the 80s/90s and beyond before players really had any kind of direct communication with developers or often even official websites. Either the game will eventually release or we can all write off the loss and move on. That's the risk we accepted by donating.
And it IS a donation, no one purchased anything. We donated toward an idea and as a thank you VR offers varying things in return in the event they are able to complete the project.
VR offers no guarantees or warranties of performance, service, Pantheon Rise of the Fallen (“PRotF”) completion or delivery of Pledge Package items.
While VR will make a best faith effort to complete, release and support PRotF, game development is a high risk endeavor. For any number of reasons, VR may not be able to complete PRotF, offer access to the game, or may not be able to deliver some or all items listed in the Pledge Packages.
Items included in Pledge Packages may be substituted, changed or eliminated at any time for any reason or no reason at the sole discretion of VR.
Access to part or all of the website, PRotF or Pledge Package items may be revoked or suspended at any time for any reason or no reason at the sole discretion of VR.
VR reserves the right to suspend, change, or cease the service (including, but not limited to, the availability of any support, item, function, feature, database, or Content) at any time for any reason or no reason. The Company may also restrict access to parts or all of the website or game without notice or liability.
VR does not offer refunds under any circumstances including but not limited to cases when it is unable to deliver all of part of a PRotF or a Pledge Package.
Just because something is offered in return doesn't make it NOT a donation. Red Cross, ASPCA, and just about any other causes/ideas offer all sorts of incentives to donate, from shirts/mugs/hats/commemorative pins to tickets to events or dinners etc. Just because you feel like it isn't a donation doesn't make it not a donation.
Anyways.....
To get back on track here...
I would like to applaud the VR team for listening to their audience and giving us or at least what some of us are asking for... a little more insight into what theyre working on, the process and also getting to know a smidge about the people behind the process. I personally appreciate your patience with those who have less than adult cognitive ability to express their opinions without making personal attacks on other posts.
Dealing with people and the grand myriad of backgrounds and personas can be taxing to say the least. Again, I really enjoyed the newsletter and the bits you expose us to. You dont have to do that, you could just make a game and publish it. But your focus on the community and taking time to give back to us is awesome. Thanks!
Orcs look fantabulous!!! Hearing the creative process that ensues to get from concept to finished-ish product is good beans! I can totally look back at deathfist orcs from EQ and see how this iteration could have evolved from there to here. The lore as well attached to what makes them, them is great info to know as well.
Cant wait to jump into Faerthal and check it out. Sounds like theres going to be alot of fun adventuring, exploring and just appreciation of graphical eye candy to be had!
/cheers
#hatersgonnahate
#babysgonnacry
#wateriswet